Let’s start with a definition: according to Urban Dictionary, hook-up culture is “The era that began in the early 1990s and has since prevailed on college campuses and elsewhere when hooking up has replaced traditional dating as the preferred method of heterosexual liaison”.
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hookup+culture
I think this ecard says it nicely:
There have been a few high profile articles about this so-called hook-up culture circulating around the internet lately, mostly focused on the women who participate in it, and then predictably, complain afterwards that they hate being treated like interchangeable blow-up dolls by men who don’t find them particularly appealing as people. Women interviewed (anonymously, which is telling in itself) at Penn State recognized that they were not going to succeed in their desires for a boyfriend, and decided to just join the blowjob party in exchange for what they COULD get:
“It’s kind of like a spiral,” she said. “The girls adapt a little bit, because they stop expecting that they’re going to get a boyfriend — because if that’s all you’re trying to do, you’re going to be miserable. But at the same time, they want to, like, have contact with guys.” So they hook up and “try not to get attached.”
Now, she said, she and her best friend had changed their romantic goals, from finding boyfriends to finding “hookup buddies,” which she described as “a guy that we don’t actually really like his personality, but we think is really attractive and hot and good in bed.”
Haley describes how the hook-up culture works in practice:
“You go in, and they take you down to a dark basement,” Haley, a blond, pink-cheeked senior, recalled of her first frat parties in freshman year. “There’s girls dancing in the middle, and there’s guys lurking on the sides and then coming and basically pressing their genitals up against you and trying to dance.”
Dancing like that felt good but dirty, and like a number of girls, Haley said she had to be drunk in order to enjoy it. Women said universally that hookups could not exist without alcohol, because they were for the most part too uncomfortable to pair off with men they did not know well without being drunk. One girl, explaining why her encounters freshman and sophomore year often ended with fellatio, said that usually by the time she got back to a guy’s room, she was starting to sober up and didn’t want to be there anymore, and giving the guy oral sex was an easy way to wrap things up and leave.
Not all women embrace the hook-up mentality, but those who don’t feel insecure about their choices.
“Am I allowed to find the person that I want to spend the rest of my life with when I’m 19?” she said. “I don’t really know. It feels like I’m not.”
Susan Patton, that “Princeton Mom” thinks women at colleges have heard the message loud and clear, even though it goes against what most of them actually want:
At one point, she asked the young women if any of them wanted to marry and have children. They at first appeared shocked by the question, then looked at one another for reassurance before, she said, “sheepishly” raising their hands.
“I thought, ‘My gosh, what have we come to that these brilliant young women are afraid to say that marriage and children are significant parts of what they view as their lifelong happiness?’ ” Ms. Patton said.
“They have gotten such strong, vitriolic messages from the extreme feminists saying, ‘Go it alone — you don’t need a man,’ ” she added.
So basically, young women are given a message that men, children, marriage and families are unimportant, they are entitled to sex, and they should happily engage in random acts of swallowing (or spitting, I suppose, depending on your preference) with men they barely know and don’t even necessarily LIKE.
“We don’t really like each other in person, sober,” she said, adding that “we literally can’t sit down and have coffee.”
And gosh, they need ALCOHOL to get through this disaster of a dating scene?
There’s a shock.
(all of the above from the NYT article)
Much of the response to the hook-up piece in the NYT has been to moan about “where the men are”. Why aren’t men being interviewed about all this? How do the men feel? How are we supposed to blame the men if we aren’t even engaging them in the conversation?
Oh, now, don’t you worry your pretty little head about that. Actual men are not required to blame all men. Amanda Marcotte can blame men for everything, at all times, with no evidence of any kind because EQUALITY FAIRNESS PATRIARCHY FEMINISM VICTIM SNOWFLAKE!
Responding to Tina Brown, who thinks young women are making a big mistake to play along, Marcotte has this to say:
Brown’s understanding of this situation is that the boys these young women are encountering are selfish in bed, treat women like they exist to serve them, and are crass and rude. But the young women are nonetheless supposed to make these young men their boyfriends or else they’re “editing out tenderness, intimacy, excitement, somebody respecting them”. I don’t mean to be an asshole here, but how? If a guy treats you like a blow job machine whose pleasure is irrelevant, then he’s not going to be a source of tenderness, intimacy, etc. He’s just a dick, and trying to make him your boyfriend is a waste of your time—and these women are clear they have better things to do.
Selfish dicks.
Selfish dicks.
Selfish dicks.
Did we get that?
Men are selfish dicks who treat women like blowjob machines. Apparently, it has not occurred to Amanda that perhaps the reason men treat women like blowjob machines is because the women are ACTING LIKE BLOWJOB MACHINES!?!?
I wonder why Amanda can’t see that?
Girls who buy the line that there’s something wrong with them if they don’t have or want a boyfriend at that age end up spending a lot of time sitting around a messy college apartment, being ignored by their “boyfriend” while he plays video games with his bros. I saw it. Hell, I did it. It sucks.
You did it? I’ll bet you did, sweetie.
The reality is that many of the young men who are all caught up in masculine posturing in college mellow out afterwards and become completely eligible bachelors who are totally capable of offering love and support in return for getting it. Part of what helps a lot of them on their journey is realizing that you can’t actually keep a girlfriend if you don’t treat her well. They are not even remotely helped, therefore, by encouraging women to cling to them like life rafts, lest said women get accused of being cold-hearted bitches. By having some fucking standards and not trying to turn “texts you for a beej and boots you out the door” guy into your boyfriend, these young women are probably speeding up the process that turns a belligerent young man who is afraid that intimacy will make him grow vaginas to a young man who puts all that behind him to enjoy the pleasures of actually hanging out with and enjoying the company of women you have sex with.
Hahahahahahah!
That’s just too funny. Yeah, hand out blowjobs like party favors at a McDonald’s restaurant opening, because that will make men eventually grow up and love you!
Good plan.
I sincerely feel sorry for any woman who takes Marcotte and her ilk seriously. Embrace your slut! Accept those booty call texts! Go down on as many randoms as you can! You’re actually helping them understand the value of women! Make sure you’re good and trashed when you do it, too. And if it doesn’t work out quite the way you hoped, you can always accuse him of raping you.
Ah, romance!
Competing with sluts is actually really, really easy, and Marcotte’s advice makes it even easier! Any young lady that takes my advice will have her pick of men, who will be devoted to her, as long as she is devoted to him. And if it requires alcohol to carry out my advice, he’s the wrong guy. Or you’re an alcoholic. Either way, it’s wrong.
http://judgybitch.com/2012/11/12/sluts-lower-the-value-of-all-women-heres-how-to-compete-with-them/
The conversation took an interesting turn today at Jezebel, where the ladies proclaim that hook-up culture is a rich, white girl thing. All the other ladies have the whole relationship thing worked out, and know how to encourage intimacy and attachment and establish meaningful connections with their sexual partners.
…many young black kids have a desire to disprove the historical assumption that black people are “hypersexual” and therefore are more careful about their sexual activities.
http://jezebel.com/hookup-culture-is-a-thing-rich-white-kids-do-867044582
I’m reading a very fascinating book by a man named Tom Burrell called “Brainwashed: Challenging the Myth of Black Inferiority”. Tom is not some liberal arts trained PhD student desperately trying to wade through the stickiness of post-modernist/feminist/heteronormative/cis-gendered/bullshit theory, like so many other people who write on issues of race and class and gender.
No, Tom is one of the founding partners of Burrell Communications, an incredibly successful and profitable advertising agency that specializes in targeting black consumers, so his words are written through the lens of what works in practice, not in theory.
I’ll take an adman over an academic, any day.
Burrell’s chapter on black sexuality and family formation is disturbing, to say the least. He charts out how the legacy of slavery and early emancipation was deliberately designed to fracture black families and make it incredibly difficult for black men and women to see each other as fully realized humans.
A common, modern critique of black culture is that plenty of other groups have had a rough go in terms of being dehumanized, vilified, and outright murdered throughout our long, sad history, and have still managed to maintain their basic orientation towards family and community. Most notably, Jewish people, subjected to the Holocaust, mass murder and plenty of anti-Semitism across the globe have still managed to be productive, functional members of civilized society.
The Holocaust lasted 12 years.
Slavery lasted 250 years.
That’s a whole lot more time to destroy the foundations of a culture. And the reverberations have carried across a wider gulf of time.
The effect of slavery on families is pretty much a no-brainer. Children could be, and were sold away from their families. Marriages were either outright forbidden, or destroyed at the will of the slavemaster. Once it became illegal to import new slaves, existing slaves were used as breeding stock, and the bonds of family were completely and utterly irrelevant.
What I found very interesting was how early welfare laws STILL acted to destroy black families. In order for a woman to be eligible for benefits, she could not have a man in the house. She had to choose between her children and her husband.
Here is how Burrell lays out the historically rooted dysfunction in black families:
Disrespect: words of mutual contempt, ridicule, wide mistrust of mates
Roots: Black family life, not conducive to a slave based economy, was disrupted, disrespected, and destroyed. Black men and women were stripped of their roles as parents and protectors. Soceity, through the welfare system, dismissed black fathers
The beat-down: disproportionate rates of physical, verbal, spiritual, and psychological abuse in black families
Roots: Slaves and descendants were conditioned to accept physical and psychological abuse. Emulation of slave-era dominant males norms continues today with a misplaced sense of “manhood” and reaction to powerlessness
Can’t be true to my Boo: the acceptance and expectation of infidelity
Roots: Result of male slave emasculation and bearing witness to misogynistic, humiliating crimes against black women. Black men portrayed as unreliable and unable to protect. Black women portrayed as the property of white males. Unquestioned belief in black male and female unworthiness.
Icing: Emotional shutdown and distance that fosters unhealthy relationships
Roots: Slaves learned to endure conditions outside their control. Protective mechanisms to provide family safety fractured during slavery. Generational acceptance of trauma and instability of black life.
What I find most compelling about Tom’s book is that he is not offering EXCUSES for how black culture operates, nor is he asking for ACCEPTANCE. He is offering an EXPLANATION, and using his analysis of how and why certain aspects of the culture came to be as a means of charting a way out of the mess that exists now.
And he very clearly points out that white, especially liberal, thinkers are a key part of the strategy to CONTINUE to represent black people as inherently inferior all the while pretending to be sympathetic and understanding.
The Jezebel article about hook-up culture is a perfect example. By claiming hook-up is a white thing, the writers can pat themselves on the back for NOT engaging those nasty racial stereotypes about “hypersexual” black folks just wanting sex and popping out babies willy-nilly. Of course, they still have to make sure the stereotype gets engaged by mentioning how they are NOT engaging the stereotype, but they conveniently put the words into the mouths of black students themselves.
It would be racist for Jezebel to say such a thing directly.
It’s even more racist to ignore it.
By only focusing on the elite, the successful black college kids who keep it in their pants, Jezebel ignores and therefore allows all the young black men and women struggling through a massively dysfunctional culture to seem normal, natural and ultimately responsible for their own predicaments.
And ultimately, they are. But that doesn’t mean there are not a whole lot of structural and psychological factors that come into play. Again, those factors are NOT excuses, they are explanations and they offer a road map for how to tackle the issues facing the black community.
Seven out of every ten black children are born out of wedlock, into families that have no fathers present on a permanent basis.
How does that sneak by the “hook-up” culture radar? The real headline on the Jezebel piece should have been “White girls better at birth control and abortion”, which leads to a whole different set of critiques. Or maybe it should have been “White girls better at blowjobs”, since it’s pretty hard to get pregnant from a blowjob.
I have often pointed out that feminism, upon closer examination, appears to actively hate women. Marcotte’s advice to engage in casual, meaningless oral sex as a means to teach men to value women falls right into that camp. Women need to be drunk to override their basic impulses NOT to do that, but feminism still goes all rah-rah-blowjobs-for-everyone! Rather than treat women’s basic instincts as right and proper and valuable and worthy, feminism seeks to get women to deny their most simple needs.
Articles like “hook-up culture is a white thing”, while superficially appearing to be race-progressive (tee hee – only white girls are sluts!) is an active part of the dialogue to ensure that black families continue to be subject to the pressures that make their formation so damn difficult. Black women are right to be very suspicious of feminism.
http://dearwhitefeminists.wordpress.com/
Feminism isn’t just about female superiority: it’s about WHITE female superiority. The vast majority of white, college-educated women will go on to marry and produce children within the legal bonds of matrimony, because white women aren’t stupid. There are enormous advantages to being married, and it remains one of the very best ways to create wealth and transfer it to the next generation. Marriage is what allows the divorce industry to flourish, so even when those smart, white ladies decide it’s time to trade in for Husband 2.0, they still keep most of the families accumulated wealth.
http://www.livescience.com/8049-college-educated-women-stay-married.html
And there is a competitive advantage to keeping the number of married, stable families limited to white ones. It’s pretty easy to compete against the single mamas and fathers paying child support to six different women when you’re a rich white lady married to an equally rich white dude.
Pointing out that hook-up culture is NOT a white thing, and that it is having a devastating effect on black families is not racist.
Ignoring it, all the while congratulating oneself on being so liberal and progressive, most definitely IS.
The problem is not what a bunch of drunk white sorority girls do during their downtime at college. It’s how that culture takes an already problematic idea and makes it so much worse for everyone who is NOT a drunk white sorority girl. The empowered slut trope makes it virtually impossible to discuss subjects like fidelity and kindness and intimacy and connection and attachment and commitment and marriage without coming off sounding like some Bible-thumping Puritan intent on shutting down all fun forever.
By and large, white folks don’t NEED to discuss fidelity and kindness and intimacy and connection and attachment and commitment and marriage, because we haven’t been subject to centuries of social engineering to make sure those things are almost impossible to achieve.
There are, however, some people who DO need to openly, actively, proactively and strategically discuss those topics. By shutting down that conversation, we ensure black culture continues to flail around in darkness. Feminism doesn’t want black men and women to have that discussion.
Why not, ladies? Are you afraid to compete? Afraid that a culture coming out of such turmoil and devastation might discover what younger white women, having lived through the nuclear devastation of their mother’s feminism are coming to understand in ever increasing numbers?
We are meant to live in harmony with one another. We are meant to have children and raise them in loving, stable families. Men and women are meant to complement, and not compete with one another. Humans are social creatures. We are meant to live in families.
And the more of those families that are black, the better off we will all be. Keeping black culture in turmoil by engaging white liberal guilt is a key part of denying that families matter. That children matter. That men matter.
“Go it alone — you don’t need a man”
That’s a message far more black women receive, and act on, than white women. It’s not racist to point that out.
It’s racist NOT to.
Lots of love,
JB
judgybitch 
Hookup culture isn’t happening because “men” want it, it’s happening because the top 10% of men want it and the women would rather “hook up” with them then find a man who actually cares about her.
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The top ten percent have ALWAYS wanted it. What’s changed is a group of women encouraging other women to do it, because it will teach men to like women.
How does that make any sense at all? Who believes this?
A lot of women, apparently.
The fact they need booze to get through random hook-ups says a lot.
It’s NOT what most women want. Why are young women such brainless sheep?
I really don’t get it.
Can none of them think for themselves?
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I’m a non-white guy who’s pretty much had zero luck with the ladies. Never had sex til now, in my mid-30s. Not because I didn’t have the opportunity (I knew some BJ-sluts as mentioned above) – but because I’m a stupid romantic who likes long walks on the beach and shit and not just put my manbits into some random woman’s mouth. But also really shy thus it’s hard to take the next step from being nice to a lady to wanting something more.
Jezebel probably thinks I’m one of those horrid “nice guys” they dread so much; the ones who treat women nicely so I can have a chance at a relationship (not just sex mind you, but I don’t suppose that matters to the Jezzies). I don’t really know what else to do but be nice though?
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The point I really want to focus on is the point you made about feminists hating women. I agree, but I don’t think it is a conscious thing. You see, what I think is that they are eaten alive by envy, and see everything “female” as being something that is holding them back, and something to be cast off as baggage.
Women are hypergamous by nature, not promiscuous. Yet, feminists push for women to be promiscuous – something that is against their ingrained nature, and something that is destined to make them unhappy in the long run. Why do they do this? Because they see men as being promiscuous by nature, and their envy is eating them alive, so they push for women to be more like men – more promiscuous.
Every single facet of the “preferred” feminist lifestyle is designed to make women miserably unhappy, because it is designed to make women be men. The problem is that women don’t want to be men – they are designed, ingrained, and wired to be women, and to want what women want.
I think it is a sign of the utter failure of our society in the last thirty years that those girls in that college class were ashamed to admit that what they really wanted was a family, and children, and a husband who loved them, rather than a career and ambition and personal accomplishment through work (accomplishements that, no matter how you spin it, will be hollow and meaningless for 99.99% of the people on Earth). ASHAMED!
What the fuck is the matter with us when we’ve so thoroughly indoctrinated these poor kids to deny what they know will make them happy, and instead to choose that which they know will make them miserable? How can people like Marcotte sleep at night knowing that they are setting up an entire generation of women to be as miserable as they all are?
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It’s NOT what most women want.
I disagree, because why else would it be happening if women didn’t want it? Women haven’t lost their power to say ‘no.’ Women say ‘no’ to betas all the time.
What is happening is that women got what they wanted, now they don’t want what they got.
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The point I really want to focus on is the point you made about feminists hating women. I agree, but I don’t think it is a conscious thing. You see, what I think is that they are eaten alive by envy, and see everything “female” as being something that is holding them back, and something to be cast off as baggage.
Women are hypergamous by nature, not promiscuous. Yet, feminists push for women to be promiscuous – something that is against their ingrained nature, and something that is destined to make them unhappy in the long run. Why do they do this? Because they see men as being promiscuous by nature, and their envy is eating them alive, so they push for women to be more like men – more promiscuous.
Every single facet of the “preferred” feminist lifestyle is designed to make women miserably unhappy, because it is designed to make women be men. The problem is that women don’t want to be men – they are designed, ingrained, and wired to be women, and to want what women want.
All of this, but what is also true is that the envy comes from these ugly feminists who CAN’T compete with these young and.or beautiful women. These feminists are angry that THEY will never have a chance at real wife and motherhood with an Alpha, so they are determined to try and ruin it for the other women who can.
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Women are also frequently consumed by jealousy toward other women. If a woman ignores the hook-up culture and successfully marries a good man and has his children, she will be scorned as being a doormat to her husband and family- especially is she chooses not to work.
I think feminist culture is driven by the women who never had a chance at a traditional life. They are the ones who are too fat, too unattractive, too shrill, too promiscuous, or just too dumb to attract a good man. If I’m wrong I’d love to the see the feminist who doesn’t fit that mold. All I typically see are the Lindy West types.
To see this in action just look at PostSecret from this last weekend. There’s a “secret” up that says “I think all stay-at-home-moms are lazy.” That postcard and the comments that follow are, in my opinion, nothing but a jealous reaction from women who don’t have the option to marry or stay home with their kids and choose to lash out at other women instead of looking at what they might be doing wrong themselves. Feminism doesn’t lend itself to introspection.
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You’re going to get a lot of shaming from some of the men on this site for being the nice guy – prepare for that.
That being said, you need to do what you feel is right. No one else on this Earth can tell you what you need to do to be content and satisfied with your choices and your way of dealing with anything, including women. We can all give advice, and you are welcome to take it or leave it, either way.
I’m a non-white guy who’s pretty much had zero luck with the ladies.
The question you need to ask yourself is this – do you want to? How did you get into your mid-30’s without having luck with someone? Is it because you’re perfectly happy not having luck with the ladies? Because if so, don’t feel pressure to change that – if you’re okay with it, go with it.
Never had sex til now, in my mid-30s. Not because I didn’t have the opportunity (I knew some BJ-sluts as mentioned above) – but because I’m a stupid romantic who likes long walks on the beach and shit and not just put my manbits into some random woman’s mouth.
Perfectly admirable, yet, this sentence is likely to become subject to some pretty severe shaming here, so prepare for that. I also had little use for the hookup culture. I fell for its allure for about 10 days upon starting college. 10 days into college I met the woman who would eventually become my wife, and in an attempt to emulate the ways that a man is supposed to act in the “hookup” culture, I was a total drunken ass to her. She didn’t want anything to do with me afterwards, and I don’t blame her.
A few days later, after I had sufficiently convinced myself that I needed to redeem myself, I convinced her to go out on a date with me, and was actually me instead of some PUA caricature of what I was expected to be by the “hookup” culture, and amazingly enough, she fell in love with me and had my children. I never apologized, but I did explain why I had done what I did, and she accepted that and told me that she had felt the same pressures upon arriving at college, herself.
The shame, to me, in what I had done, is not that I’d treated a stranger poorly, although that is not something admirable, but that I’d compromised who I was, and who I wanted to be, in order to fit the expected social norms. My suggestion to you is that you don’t fall into that trap. Don’t allow yourself to be compromised by what others expect from you. Be you. Work to improve yourself based on your vision of who you want to be, not what other people expect from you. But this is the kicker…
I don’t really know what else to do but be nice though?
Improve. Don’t stop being nice, and don’t listen to the fuckheads that tell you that being nice will never get you laid. You don’t have to be an asshole, or manipulative, or even compromise who you are in order to find a mate. But you need something more than “being nice.” Ladies, especially desirable ladies, have men being nice to them all the time. There is nothing to make you stand out from the crowd of men being nice to her if all you offer is being nice. She can find 100 different men that will be nice to her – that’s kind of a prerequisite for most intelligent women, who won’t give guys that are not nice to them the time of day.
So my suggestion is this:
Put some time into thinking about what the woman that you want to be involved with will desire from you – what will set you apart from the crowd of men being nice to her – and develop that in yourself. Make yourself desirable to the woman that you would want to be with. Then, you can evaluate what you want from her and decide if she’s right or you or not, but I’ve found that taking a bit of time to put others first is a huge step in the right direction towards making yourself someone that someone else would want to be with. Even if you are nice, if your only motivation is selfish, you probably won’t succeed.
Flame suit on (not for you, but for all the MGTOWs and PUAs on here that are fixing to verbally kick my ass for what I just said)
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It’s always funny when I see “race statistics” like the one linked in this entry, where whites are always leading in the lowest rate for out-of-wedlock births. What’s one race I never see on these surveys? ASIANS. Asians, by FAR, have the lowest out of wed lock births of all races.
The surveys that are NOT promoting “white people are the best” clearly indicate that Asians have babies out of wed lock about half as much as whites. 11% Asian to 26% white. Others show 15% Asian to 30% white.
This was a very interesting read. Brainwashed sounds like a great book, will purchase asap.
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Funny how you and scorch both nailed the same point within seconds of each other. Its a good point, but I really hope you’re both wrong, because it takes the leap from “woefully misguided” to “actively malfeasant” and that has some pretty horrifying implications.
What kind of awful human would actively and knowingly sabotage another person’s entire life just to make herself feel better?
Jesus….
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83% of statistics are made up on the spot, anyway.
Everybody is trying to tell their own story, and you seem to have found it here. Not “blacks have a problem ” so muchas “look at how much better whites are than blacks”.
What other purpose could leaving the Asian stat out serve?
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I don’t believe that blacks having a lower marriage rate has anything to do with slavery. According to Thomas Sowell “Official census data show that blacks has slightly higher marriage rates than whites for every census between 1840 to 1940, but far lower marriage rates by 1960.”
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It’s a good point, but I really hope you’re both wrong, because it takes the leap from “woefully misguided” to “actively malfeasant” and that has some pretty horrifying implications.
What kind of awful human would actively and knowingly sabotage another person’s entire life just to make herself feel better?
uMMM……..have you met many women?
Clearly not.
Women for the most part live their lives by comparison. Socially. As measured by other women.
It’s not enough for a woman to have big titties….her titties have to be bigger than every other woman’s. Not enough for her to have a big house…her house has to be bigger than all of her friends’ houses. Not enough for her to have a good man…her man has to be better than all her girlfriends’ men. Not enough to have good children…her children have to be better than all the other mothers’ kids.
All of this is pretty standard issue life operation for women.
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Here’s an interesting perspective on what destroyed the family as an institution among African-Americans:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704881304576094221050061598.html
Just something else to think about.
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I concur. Slavery has nothing to do with it. The Black Family didn’t fall apart until the 1970’s, so to blame slavery is a red herring.
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Hook up culture was actually alive and well long before the 1990’s. I remember the 80’s music scene quite well but back then we called them groupies and as a 20 something musician I did my share of indulging I must admit. But I agree the demographic has changed since then. I don’t think a lot of it has to do with race but more with the disintegration of western culture that feminists have long fought for. Keeping feminism and racism alive, especially by the main stream media does the job of keeping the genders and races divided in the western world. A fragmented society is easier to control and manipulate. The nuclear family has been greatly destroyed and has left kids of all races in this world of broken families. Young women come of age now where many young men have figured out this feminist game and choose not to marry or become attached to one woman, why marry one when you can pump and dump a new piece of ass with some regularity. Why put up with all the I, me, my, mine, mentality that feminism has taught young women. Why the hell marry one and end up in family court where a male will have no other choice but to prepare his anus and bite the pillow because that feminized judge is going to pound it in dry. No thanks.
As for Amanda Marcotte, I have commented many times here my opinion of her and just like the rest of her feminist shitsterhood they are either blind to or not willing to admit to the world which they have cultivated for young women to navigate and be used as sex toys and thrown to the curb without regret. Most feminists won’t discuss the issues with STD’s many of these girls have, or the alcohol and drug problems many of them have but that would be an admission of feminist failure. Blame men, blame race, blame patriarchy, blame rape culture, and blame anything but the real villain which is feminism itself. I call it feminist fecal encephalopathy. Their heads are so full of shit they are delusional.
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Why the hell marry one and end up in family court where a male will have no other choice but to prepare his anus and bite the pillow because that feminized judge is going to pound it in dry. No thanks.
I call it feminist fecal encephalopathy. Their heads are so full of shit they are delusional.
Best. lines. ever.
REPLY
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But the 1960’s and 70’s is when welfare reforms came into play to prevent women from collecting benefits if they had men in the house. Burrell is pointing out how welfare reforms fell in line with slave mentality,both in terms of men not working to support their families, and in terms of convincing women that white men were better protectors.
White men = government
Again, Burrell isn’t excusing the behavior, he’s explaining it.
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While I don’t deny these women are getting a lot of bad advice, calling it “brainwashing” is the same feminist/chivalrist attitude that rationalizes a lot of female bad behavior.
Women CHOOSE to do this. They CHOOSE to hook up with the players. They CHOOSE to ignore the good guys. They know very well what they are doing, too.
If we keep giving women a pass, we are going to keep paying for it in the long run.
Women need to own their choices & their consequences.
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Most women are feral animals acting on their base desires. There are no controls put on their behavior, they are freed from all responsibilities, and told they can “have it all.”
They don’t want romance, they crave socially dominant men.
It sucks that you have been lied to your whole life about what women want.
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These are both valid criticisms, and I love this blog when it slaps me in the face, showing me that I am doing exactly what I criticize in others.
Why not include Asians in the demographics?
Is it because I’m comfortable calling attention to how white ladies end up better off than black ladies, all the while ignoring all the Asian ladies that make the white ones look like a pack of raging sluts?
Yup.
Probably.
It’s a learning curve.
And believe me, every time I write about racial demographics of any sort in the future, I will remember this post, and make sure that I am not shying away from including racial groups that behave BETTER than my own.
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As a woman I have to say that I do believe other women (not all, but many) will deliberately sabotage other women to make themselves feel better for their own poor decisions. I’ve had “friends” (who are not longer in my life) try to steal boyfriends and belittle me for making decisions based on what is best for me and my family because they were abject failures in their own lives.
The only female friends I have are also stay-at-home moms who value a stable home life. We have had conversations about only having friends who share the same values because we’ve all learned the hard way that to do otherwise just invites trouble.
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Your theory makes sense up until you look at recent black cultures from non-slave-holding minorities, such as Britain and Australia and France: all three of which took in large enough black populations to have a stable culture. And in all cases the imported non-slave black cultures ended up resembling black US culture in crime, vice, marriage rates and even gun crime. Kenyans who come to Britain act the same as African-Americans.
So, given that you cannot link the “destruction of slavery” to the US cultural milieu, how do you explain it? Given that, like blacks before the 1960’s, Kenyan-sub-cultures in London had stable birth rates, but now the same group have over 76% illegitimacy in London, what is your explanations?
I mean, it’s nice to blame whitey for everything (blacks fuck because slavery!), but given that US blacks look incredibly normal for blacks throughout the non-slave-holding West, what is your answer? Is The Man keeping people down in East London and the banlieu’s?
Only US blacks have “250 years of slavery”, but all black minorities in the West are subject to similar statistical over-representations in illegitimate births, gun crime rates, violent deaths in males over 15, and a whole host of other clearly pathological cultural activities. So how is what you say true?
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Good question.
I didn’t know that about other black cultures.
I’ll have to give it some thought.
What are your ideas about why that is?
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Gods bless her, but Judgy has yet to fully accept how feral modern women have become. Therefore, she’d rather infantilize her own gender (“they don’t want this, they’re brainwashed”) then look at the reality on the ground.
It’s ok, the red pill is a long-term treatment program, not a magic pill, so she’ll accept it eventually.
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Gods bless her, but Judgy has yet to fully accept how feral modern women have become.
I agree, but I don’t even think it’s a “become.” I think it’s more an “unleashed.” The goal of 40 years of feminism has been to convince women to throw aside all possible home training, charm, restraint, or reserve, and let loose on whatever they feel. In the 90’s, when the Clinton scandal hit, and he gave the country a pass on blow jobs(them not really being sex), I read an article containing a blurb from a senior citizen who said she regretted being born so early in the 20th century. This statement was in the context of the larger article which was about her granddaughter’s generation giving blowjobs to the boys during a BarMitzvah party. Grandma said she wished she could’ve been more of a slut in her day, but it wasn’t as acceptable, much harsher consequences back then.
My point being, that women have always wanted to unleash their slutty side, and it’s always there. It’s just social pressure that keeps it in check; take that away, and you have what we have now. So when women like JB that have had their training stick encounter the truth of today’s woman, they have a hard time processing it.
The only idea I may slightly agree with, when she says, “It’s not what they want,” needs an addendum. It’s not what they want by the time they get to their thirties and beyond. It’s not what they want by the time they hit midlife.
It is definitely what these sluts want in their teens and twenties. They just don’t like both the short & long term consequences. ….Too bad.
It’s ok, the red pill is a long-term treatment program, not a magic pill, so she’ll accept it eventually.
Gospel truth.
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The only female friends I have are also stay-at-home moms who value a stable home life. We have had conversations about only having friends who share the same values because we’ve all learned the hard way that to do otherwise just invites trouble.
Yes, and this is a good illustration of my point. Radical Suburbanite understands the power of influence, particularly female influence, and chooses to surround herself with woman that will continue to influence her along the path she wants to stay on.
At some point in your process those values got integrated into your soul, it seemed like the best idea, you went with it, but you realize you have to stay away from anything trying to poison it.
What happens to girls who only hear that Sluthood is the right way? That marriage & family will be there whenever they want it, so live it up until you’re ready(and almost out of eggs)?
What happens when they see their peers becoming cum dumpsters for the boys….how will chastity help them in that situation?
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Goober, why do you assume that the men on this site would start shaming Wallace? What on earth leads you to that conclusion? There is nothing about the manosphere (or the MHRM) that prescribes the shaming of men for wanting to be nice to women, or, in this case, just for being themselves around women.
I really can’t fathom where you’re getting this from.
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All of this, but what is also true is that the envy comes from these ugly feminists who CAN’T compete with these young and.or beautiful women.
Imagine if these physically ugly feminists were ever to wake up to the realization that their personalities are infinitely more hideous than their faces or bodies and that it is THIS that is destroying any chance they would ever have at meaningful interaction with any sort of man – or any other decent human being, for that matter.
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Women are also frequently consumed by jealousy toward other women. If a woman ignores the hook-up culture and successfully marries a good man and has his children, she will be scorned as being a doormat to her husband and family- especially is she chooses not to work.
It’s a sad commentary on the current state of affairs that any self-respecting young woman (or young man, for that matter) would give a microsecond’s worth of serious thought to what others who have no stake or interest in their well-being think about their choices in life.
I would really like to think that most young women aren’t quite acerebral herd-followers who would be dissuaded by “majority opinion” from doing what’s clearly in their own best interests. It’s probably wishful thinking, but it’s a hope nonetheless.
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I’d be willing to bet that the OOW birth rate for Asians in North America is probably in the middle or low single digits. As successive generations of Asians become more Americanized, that figure will probably rise (although I certainly hope not), but I find it hard to believe, just based on daily observation, that the OOW birth rate for Asians even in the western world is anything close to even 11 percent.
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If a woman is smart she sees the outcome of the slut culture and avoids it. I can, and will, do my best to counter the feminist indoctrination my daughter will face throughout her life but she’ll have to rely on her own intelligence and integrity in the long run.
Chastity helps, in my opinion, because the only men worth spending your life with will value it. Women, despite all their “sisterhood” claims still spend most of their time competing over men. Smart girls realize that the best way to get the best men is to be a quality woman yourself and to not emulate the worst behavior of the herd.
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I would really like to think that most young women aren’t quite acerebral herd-followers who would be dissuaded by “majority opinion” from doing what’s clearly in their own best interests. It’s probably wishful thinking, but it’s a hope nonetheless.
Just a fantasy. Girls will do what they see other girls do. Girls will be friends with females they hate just to have friends & not be alone. Girls will do whatever the most popular girls are doing to get and keep male attention. Rare is the female that is truly an independent thinker, and with rare exceptions, those that are owe it to their lack of feminine allure. They recognize it and realize they need to win at life some other way.
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I’ve had “friends” (who are not longer in my life) try to steal boyfriends and belittle me for making decisions based on what is best for me and my family because they were abject failures in their own lives.
My wife, due to unresolved issues in her own past, had in the recent past a terrible propensity for making friends with women of this type: bat-shit-crazy, jealous, manipulative, unstable, perpetually single (as in never married and never could be married) women who could not stand to see her married to a man who provided a stable home and who did everything they could to alienate my wife from it. One of these bitches very nearly wrecked our marriage a decade ago. The silver lining is that my wife woke up and learned from that experience. When making friends with any woman, at the first sign of jealous, bat-shit-crazy nastiness, she ends the friendship abruptly. Sadly, she seems to encounter more of these types than those who are “normal,” but having been burned once, she’s not about to play in that yard again.
So, yes, women DO, very frequently, operate in “scorched earth” mode with other women.
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I think, in the end, most women do what’s best for themselves regardless of majority opinion. The problem is that it’s so easy to be influenced by the herd when you’re young. College-age women are the most vulnerable to feminist indoctrination and that can take years to wear off. By the time it does a girl may find that her best years are behind her and that she has a very reduced ability to find a good man and start a family. Which only intensifies the jealousy she feels toward women who didn’t make the same mistakes. I’ve seen it first hand.
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You keep using the word “smart.”
My question is, is that smartness innate? It can’t be gender based, or else all girls would have it & we wouldn’t be having this discussion. So that would point to a personality or giftedness difference among females.
Or is that smartness learned? Is it the result of your mother & your upbringing pouring red pill based teaching into your soul?
Women, despite all their “sisterhood” claims still spend most of their time competing over men. Smart girls realize that the best way to get the best men is to be a quality woman yourself and to not emulate the worst behavior of the herd.
Gospel truth.
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“blow job machine” That’s hilarious. I’ll put it into my hookup vocabulary next to “pincushion” and “golf course”.
But seriously, it’s interesting that economic structures disintegrate families. Slavery disintegrated the black family, and modern corporate culture’s need for flexibility and mobility is tearing apart the modern white family.
I wouldn’t blame men or women for a thing that needs to happen. In order to make more efficient workers, the family has to go. Family people ask for more time off than single people, and for some stupid reason, they seem to keep asking for time with their kids (silly). But in the tight margin world of corporate culture, every second counts. So the adjustment from family to hook-up is natural. If sex is to happen at all, it needs to be “fast food” sex. No time to sit down for dinner.
Immigration will handle the need for replacements.
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I think smartness is essentially innate because a woman has to have the ability to think outside the group mentality she will be exposed to for most of her life. Women I consider to be smart are the ones who never dabbled in the hook-up culture and are not prone to caving to peer pressure.
Clearly people can learn and change, but I think there has to be a glimmer of hope early on.
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Those women are the worst. The ones for whom it is too late, or they waited so long, threw away terrific guys and ended up married to what they could get at the Uterus Closing Out Sale.
I’ll confess I am one lucky bitch to have had the foresight to get to MBA school and do some damn near close to last minute shopping myself.
I threw away an awesome man at nineteen because I believed, like the woman in the interview, that it just had to be WRONG to find the man of my dreams at nineteen.
He is married to a lovely woman and has five children.
*sniff*
I wanted five children. I could have had them with Mr. JB, I suppose, but I didn’t want to be having children that old, and I wanted three years between each one! If you want five, spaced apart, you need to start early!
I’m grateful I have three.
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I think, in the end, most women do what’s best for themselves regardless of majority opinion.
This is EIGHTEEN KINDS of WRONG, and just points more to you being in a bubble. Here is that statement corrected for accuracy:
I think, in the end, a very small percentage of women do what’s best for themselves regardless of majority opinion.
As I, and many other men can attest to, most women don’t know what they want, will do what other girls do, will change their minds 27 times a day, will follow their vadge tingles and give their best years to men that aren’t worthy of them. Men that will impregnate, cheat on, and ultimately leave them to start over with his brood. Then hope to land a beta sucker to pay for the party.
As Sunshine Mary has pointed out, what’s actually best for the women that want families is, starting very young, picking a mate well, and if they want to have a career, doing it part time once the children are grown and out, but never defrauding their husbands sexually or trying to usurp his authority. This leads to maximum female happiness.
You think most women do that? *shakes head no*
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I didn’t meet the man of my dreams until I was 25- but I didn’t pass up any quality candidates in the meantime. My husband frequently praises my intelligence in recognizing his worth when other women were stupidly looking down their noses at him. He’s absolutely right- I was very smart when I took him off the market. 🙂
And despite not having five kids, you have Mr. JB- that has to be an awesome consolation prize.
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Well, I can’t argue your point because you’re most likely correct. What I probably should have said was not that they do what’s *best* for themselves, but what they selfishly believe is in their own best interests regardless of how it affects anyone else or what the majority of their friends would argue is the “right” thing to do.
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Those women are the worst. The ones for whom it is too late, or they waited so long, threw away terrific guys and ended up married to what they could get at the Uterus Closing Out Sale.
Stealing this.
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Oh, absolutely! I am not complaining!
🙂
I think the idea of “One True Love” is really destructive. It makes no sense mathematically. What are the odds that there is one, and only one person out of 7 billion that you are compatible with?
There are lots. I meet men all the time who make me think, “yup, we would do just fine together”. But I’ve made my choice. And I’m sure my husband meets women he gets along with really well all the time, too. One of my closest friends and Mr. JB get along incredibly well. Their personalities just match up really well.
Doesn’t threaten me in the least.
He’s made his choice too.
Reason #6547 it’s dumb to trade in for Spouse 2.0 is that you may get rid of one set of annoying behaviours, but 2.0 will bring a whole new set, guaranteed!
Ugh. Who the hell wants to go through figuring out how to manage someone’s irritating traits twice?
Once is enough for me.
We’ve agreed to annoy each other in really specific, predictable ways.
That’s what I call “love”.
Speaking of annoying, I have no idea where my wallet is. I better find it before he gets home. And I should probably find the cordless phones, too.
😛
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Slavery would not have to be indigenous to be influential. American culture created slavery and slavery created the disintegration of the black family. American cultural influence then spreads that influence overseas.
Hell, you go to Korea and you can hear black rap and references to african american hookup culture..
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example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TloLiJE5jsM
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JB,
Trinidad had only 30+ years of plantation slavery. It was always a stopover island that no one took the effort to cultivate until close to Emancipation.
I grew up in the 60s and all I knew of blacks were married families, rich and poor. There was the mistress culture but the MFSB core was always there, by and large. Blacks were upwardly mobile, education was a priority and so was religion.
Come the 70s, Black Power and the Afro-American civil rights movement was imported and interpreted as a local problem. Blacks who felt their progress up the social ladder was too slow now had ‘reasons’.
Trinidad faced social unrest, guerrilla movements, two bloody coups and has been grappling with race politics (50% from India, 50% from Africa) ever since.
Politicians have played those grievances like a fiddle. Free school, free house, free stereo, black hegemony in the civil service, you name it.
Trinidad now has one of the highest murder rates in the world. Guess whose shooting who? That breakdown did not take 350 years.
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So what do you think happened? What was the influence that caused such turmoil? Just patience? Materialistic values?
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lately i’ve thinking more and more that if we dropped the push for women to be independent and part of the workforce, this kind of stuff wouldn’t happen. less push -> less feeling they have to go through college -> less being available to engage in hook-up. not saying that we should prevent women from being a part of the workforce at all, just that it has caused some issues
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Agreed. I have always felt at odds with “American values” and it amazes me how supposedly “alternative thinkers” and “red pillers” seem to champion them.
They think the founding fathers were exemplars of ethics and morals and would be turning over in their graves today if they could see the “injustices” of our current system.
Are you kidding me?
These are men who did not value labor, work ethic or family to the extreme extent of breaking up families in order to have them individually work FOR FREE.
Take the red pill peeps!
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It has to do with demographics, education levels and class.
East and South Asians are known as “model minorities” in the US but the demographs of East and South Asians that immigrate here are of a certain type of East and South Asian before they get here.
The US screens for that.
The UK also has a sizeable South Asian population but there’s is more diverse. You have the Indian model minorities who are professional Hindus, Sikhs and sometimes Muslims who pay taxes, get married, stay married and carrying on in upper middle class ways, and then you’ve got the lower income Pakistani and Bangladeshi Muslims who go on the dole, fail to assimilate and ghettoize themselves.
Now as far as African immigrants in the US, the ones we allow in are largely classy, educated and family oriented. They are also in the model minority category along with our South and East Asians.
Sometimes they even distance themselves from native Africa Americans because they don’t want their kids being influenced by the out of wedlock births and consequent poverty and dysfunction.
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How does it follow that they will hook up less if they don’t go to college? There are more places to meet men than just in college. Men can be met anywhere, including on the internet.
It has more to do with culture than with access to higher education and careers.
In fact, statistics show that the demographic more likely to marry, have kids after marriage and stay married for life are university graduated women.
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These are men who did not value labor, work ethic or family to the extreme extent of breaking up families in order to have them individually work FOR FREE.
Wrong. These men were slave owners.
They didn’t want to break up THEIR families. They had no problem breaking up black families.
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JB,
Not sure why people developed more faith in politics than the codes of religion.
There was the post-colonial independence of the 60s where black politicians came to power and quickly learned how to secure votes.
Blacks found it easy to identify with Afro-Americans. Before poor families will save to educate their children but arguments like “if you’re poor, you have a right to be a criminal.” became acceptable.
I place a lot at the door of politics. You give all this money to sociopaths who just have to gee up people’s sense of victimhood and bad things happen.
Your blog highlights how dangerous the victim culture isin another sense.
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ummm… where have you been? On RTOK, roissy or roosh it would be nothing but BETA BETA BETA BETA. If a guy isn’t banging everything from a HB0 to HB1 then they are losers.
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What jimm said. I’ve been shamed on here for talking about how I don’t think all women are feral, nasty creatures like so many want to describe. i’ve been shamed for refusing to game women and instead wanting to be nice to them. I stated this because I was absolutely sure that it was fixing to happen, and I wanted to run those that would do so off at the pass before they got here.
The MRM, while full of good guys, also has a bunch of kool-aid drinkers in it that love nothing more than to talk about how their way is the only way, and shame anyone that doesn’t do it their way.
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If I’ve been lied to, it is by my own senses and my own experiences. The women (plural) in my life are mostly very decent, very kind, loving people. None of them are perfect, but they sure as hell don’t “act on their base desires” and they all have pretty good “controls on their behavior”.
Hundreds and hundreds of women that I know, personally, that don’t even remotely approach what you’re describing. Judgy Bitch, in my world, isn’t a one-off…
She’s the norm.
Let me guess, you live in New York or LA?
Because here in Eastern Washington/Northern Idaho, the women don’t even remotely resemble what you’re describing…
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I agree that women tend to be very competitive, but actual bad acts to drag other women down? Malfeasant attempts to literally ruin another person’s life to make herself feel better?
Where the fuck do you guys live? What women are you dating? Jesus H… You really need to consider a change in scenery…
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He’s not correct, RadicalSuburbanite. not by a long shot. Not as long as he uses the word “most”. If “most” women were really like he says, then our species would have failed eons ago.
I know way too many dedicated wives and doting mothers for any of this to stick.
Are there a lot of women like he describes? Sure. Most? Fuck no…
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Wasn’t talking about you, but rather the person who published the study that you used.
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But I did it, too.
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I’ve seen very unattractive women bag great guys simply by having great personalities. One of my best friends married a gal that isn’t all that much to look at, but we all love her to death because she is a great person.
Lindy West isn’t that ugly – she could find a decent guy if she had a good personality. Even Shona Sibrary’s looks would go from “hideously ugly” to “kitchy and quirky” if she’d just fucking smile once in a while.
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I know way too many dedicated wives and doting mothers for any of this to stick.
But you don’t know everything about them. Prior relationships, N counts, abortions, etc. You also don’t know the success count of their children.
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What is an N count?
Oh god, is that a sample size?
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I don’t know Goober. I had a lot of women treat me like I was some kind of odd little creature when I decided to stay home with my kids– until they realized they wanted to do the same thing. Maybe it’s due to where I live (California) but you run into a lot more careerist-type women here than anything else.
I live in a nice little suburb where most of us stay home with the kids but most of my husband’s friends have wives who work because it’s too expensive to do otherwise (or, more accurately, they acclimated themselves to a lifestyle and won’t go backwards for the sake of the kids).
I know one woman who lived with her boyfriend for 15 years and wouldn’t get married unless he took her name! She finally got pregnant but they broke up before the baby was born. I have another friend whose child is mostly raised by a nanny while the wife works two jobs- she doesn’t need to, she wants to. In fact, I know a number of women who have handed their kids off to nannies despite having more than enough income to stay home.
There’s a real divide here where I live. The higher income areas are more likely to have two working parents and the middle income areas (like mine) are more likely to have stay-at-home moms. So where we live probably does have a lot to do with our perception of modern motherhood. I’m so glad I moved out of the higher income area to where I am now- I’m so much happier.
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What is an N count?
N count is the number of sexual partners one has had.
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For a good portion of them, i do know most of those things, Scorch. For a few of them, I was one of the “Ns” in their count! Remember, small towns and all.
We just don’t seem to have the same problems here that you are having wherever it is that you are.
As for success of their children, to a huge extent, that’s not fair – first off, we’re too young to have adult children yet. Second, bad kids come from good families all the time. My aunt and uncle had three kids. Two turned out awesome. one is a crack whore loser.
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California. I rest my case. The feminism runs like foul, foul ether down in that God-forsaken country.
And I’m not just talking about stay at home moms. I’m one that disagrees a bit with JB on the whole “working mom” thing to a certain extent. A woman can work outside the home and not be a horrible person, even when she has young children.
And the stay at home mom thing is so politically charged, it doesn’t surprise me that people get a little nervous about the discussion. But I’m not talking about the decision to stay at home or not, I’m talking about accusations that women are so selfish, so feral – so inconceivably broken that they fit the bill that Scorch is giving them. And I don’t care where you are, unless it is downtown New York or LA, what he’s saying just isn’t true for the majority of women.
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I’m in Chicago, but I think I agree with Radical Suburbanite, it depends on the pocket of the city you’re in, and what you’re surrounded by.
These women up here where I live won’t even speak to you unless you drive a certain level car.
The families that are more focused on traditional values are in isolated smaller pockets.
The richer Conservative families just buy their daughters however many abortions they need until they can get married. White privilege goes a long way.
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I’m talking about accusations that women are so selfish, so feral – so inconceivably broken that they fit the bill that Scorch is giving them. And I don’t care where you are, unless it is downtown New York or LA, what he’s saying just isn’t true for the majority of women.
I’ve been told that before, maybe it is the women I’m exposed to, but again, doting wives & mothers up here are either:
1) The homeschoolers, which are like Christian Amish
2) The suburbanite wives, who are desperately trying to stay skinny and 25ish-looking for their incredibly rich but always gone husbands.
Most of the other women are looking for an ATM to marry after getting off the cock carousel.
Again…..I’m in Chicago.
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“As Sunshine Mary has pointed out, what’s actually best for the women that want families is, starting very young, picking a mate well, and if they want to have a career, doing it part time once the children are grown and out”
Sounds like some sort of unachievable Utopian ideal.
Its very hard to enter a mainstream career track in middle age. Often the same kind of Utopian commenter will counter – start your own business. Not everyone has the ability to be a successful entrepreneur. Some people do better at working for someone else.
If a woman really wants a career and family then she will have to cultivate both simultaneously. It may be that she has to take a few years off when the child is a baby, but going back into the work force in a career that you’ve already established at the age of 29 is easier and totally different than just getting started with the whole thing at 46.
And a “part-time career”? Perhaps you mean a part-time job like working as a cashier at Walmart 3 days a week?
I don’t know what sort of “career” one could build “part time”.
Even stay at home jobs or do it yourself entrepreneurships need full time focus.
Men also have to make trade offs between family and career. So many divorces have happened because of 80 hour work weeks.
Men and women both can have careers and families simultaneously but its a balancing act.
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“California. I rest my case. The feminism runs like foul, foul ether down in that God-forsaken country. ”
Odd. My experience of California is completely different. Its my favorite US state because there are so many “conscious” people here compared to the other States, exception being perhaps the islands of Hawaii.
There’s a HUGE earthy-crunchy-mother-goddess scene here.
We’ve swallowed the red pill on American materialism. Here’s how;
We give birth naturally at home.
We grow a lot of our own food (both in and outdoors).
Run or shop at locally grown organic co-ops. Have traded in high heels for Vibrams Five Fingers (or go barefoot).
Traded shampoo and makeup for baking soda and coconut oil.
Prefer to walk or bike than drive cars so caring about what kind of cars our men drive is out of the question.
Our homes are minimalist.
We do clothing swaps rather than buy new clothes.
We don’t do TV.
Have traded in the Religious Industrial Complex for experience based meditation and philosophy.
Homeschool, or rather Unschool – that too OUTDOORS as much as we can.
I know there’s a vapid, materialistic corporate side to California, it is in the States afterall, but the scene I describe above is actually quite mainstream and very accessible here.
I love it!
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My experience with other women when I was in my 20’s was not good. Most of girls I knew were catty, jealous and mostly awful. My experience as a married mom has been much better.
I thing I have noticed is that the really awful women I knew in my 20’s did not generally end up married- they may or may not have had kids. Their behavior definitely dictated their outcomes. The good girls who were generally nice to everyone had good outcomes and are great wives and mothers. I understand what you’re saying about working moms, but I do know a lot of women who prioritize work over their kids (blatantly so) so I have a jaded view of the subject.
And you’re right about California in general. I’d leave if I could.
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But JB, to be fair, at least here in the States, there are a lot of white women with family values so deep that they even end up dating and marrying Asian men who come from very large, overbearing families.
One of the common reasons they list as to why they were attracted to these men in the first place is often “culture” and “family values”.
I say that if a man keeps experiencing “sluts” over and over again in his life, its because water seeks its own level and he is attracting slut energy into his own energy field because he has slutty tendencies himself.
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Radical Suburbanite, “And you’re right about California in general. I’d leave if I could.”
But there’s a whole other world here in California that rejects vapid American materialism. Please see above.
That’s the California I know, love and live in.
Its way less mainstream than the other States. Way more conscious.
So really, it depends on your area, your neighbors, your friends and your own values.
I moved out here to escape mainstream American values of money, status, sex, materialism, nihilism, and emptiness and to become more grounded in the earth and be in conscious community with people who shared my values of simple living and high thinking.
I found it here more than anywhere else in the States.
So don’t give up on California. Just change your association.
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Totally agree. Most women have the ability to be pleasant and *that* can make them significantly more attractive. Most women I know who are kind seem beautiful to me.
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@Take Back Your Face-
To be honest the California you describe doesn’t appeal to me. I live in NorCal and I know a lot of the minimalist types you speak of but that seems to become it’s own kind of competitiveness in my experience. I do embrace the paleo/primal lifestyle (Grok on) and do love the ability to always find locally grown food. But I’m not the earth mother type.
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“Wrong. These men were slave owners.
They didn’t want to break up THEIR families. They had no problem breaking up black families.”
That was my point.
Family values, liberty and freedom were distant, alien concepts for them to pontificate about. not to practice in their day to day lives.
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I don’t think there’s any conspiratorial reason for leaving Asians out. I think its because Asians, both East and South, are such a statistically small minority in the States, even at present, compared to Whites, Blacks and Hispanics.
However that is slowly changing and we are seeing more studies and stats taking them into account as their numbers increase.
South Asians still practice arranged marriage to a large degree. If not “arranged” then at least “assisted”. A baby-mama or baby-daddy somewhere in a prospective daughter or son-in-law’s history is an automatic veto to the union.
Even the 2nd generation South Asian-Americans who co-habitate with partners without being married are very careful about using birth control.
Being a baby-daddy or baby-mama is just not the “done thing” in that community.
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Radical Suburbanite, “I live in NorCal and I know a lot of the minimalist types you speak of but that seems to become it’s own kind of competitiveness in my experience.”
I do see some of that. Competition is part of the human group dynamic to one degree or another.
When I was single and child-free I did much better on my own, without groups or community. However when I had a baby I had to become more group and community oriented. So I chose a community that was the least of all the evils on offer.
Its easy to be an isolated introvert when you don’t have kids.
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” In the 90′s, when the Clinton scandal hit, and he gave the country a pass on blow jobs(them not really being sex), I read an article containing a blurb from a senior citizen who said she regretted being born so early in the 20th century. This statement was in the context of the larger article which was about her granddaughter’s generation giving blowjobs to the boys during a BarMitzvah party. Grandma said she wished she could’ve been more of a slut in her day, but it wasn’t as acceptable, much harsher consequences back then.”
What?!?!
I could understand Grandma regretting not be able to RECEIVE oral sex back in her day, but regretting not being able to give it?!?! Totally weird.
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“You give all this money to sociopaths who just have to gee up people’s sense of victimhood and bad things happen.”
Did you mean to say “ghee up” people’s sense of victimhood?
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What I gather is that there are a lot of college students who are not hooking up with random partners but do in fact have boyfriends and girlfriends.
The highly promiscuous hook up scene is something indulged regularly only by a minority percentage of male and female students who recycle each other.
A larger group than that are people who may have hooked up once or twice and decided its not for them.
There are also some college students going totally without either boyfriends/girlfriends or casual hookups.
But even for that tiny segment that has made casual hookups a regular part of their college life, they eventually grow out of it and enter into real relationships after they leave college and mature a bit.
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“We don’t really like each other in person, sober,” she said, adding that “we literally can’t sit down and have coffee.”
I know I’ve made this comment before, but it’s worth repeating in case any outsiders are reading this blog: if she was drunk, it wasn’t sex it was rape.
For years feminists have been telling us women can’t consent while drunk. Fine. But now they’re telling us women are “empowered” by having drunken hookup sex. Wrong! You can’t have it both ways.
IMO the school needs to get this reporter to reveal her sources so the guy in question can be charged with rape.
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There’s a song that deal with what you’re talking about. It’s called “Homebreakers” and it’s the leadoff track on the Style Council’s politically-charged 1985 album “Internationalists” (“Our Favourite Shoppe” in the UK). Although a lot of the album is pie-in-the-sky liberalism, society has moved enough to the left (and into the toiler) that the larger points Paul Weller was singing about should appeal to people on here.
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“10 days into college I met the woman who would eventually become my wife, and in an attempt to emulate the ways that a man is supposed to act in the “hookup” culture, I was a total drunken ass to her.
So in other words, you made a first impression as an asshole Alpha, then swooped back in playing “sensitive Beta game.” Well played, my friend. Well played.
***
That was my main comment. Everything else is footnotes.
You might think you did wrong with her first time around. What you don’t see is that on some primal level that’s what initially attracted her to you. The fact that you followed it up with some substance sealed the deal. My feeling is that if you had taken the Beta approach first, you would not have gotten the girl at all. Doesn’t matter what she says; few women will admit to liking the jerkiness in guys, but if she “forgave” you, she liked part of what she saw notwithstanding.
When I got on Facebook I was surprised at which women from high school and college wanted to friend me and which wouldn’t. The ones that did were the ones I was a cad with. The ones that didn’t were the ones I was “sensitive” with and sometimes didn’t even make a move on. The moral: women take indifference as a bigger insult that a bumbling, over-aggressive pickup attempt.
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college puts a lot of people together, which allows for more of getting drunk to hook-up. if women have to go through hooking-up on their own time and possibly on their own dollar, they’d do it less often. which would happen more if they didn’t go to college because they didn’t feel the need to make it big in the corporate world
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I read an article containing a blurb from a senior citizen who said she regretted being born so early in the 20th century. This statement was in the context of the larger article which was about her granddaughter’s generation giving blowjobs to the boys during a BarMitzvah party.
Jewish grandma talking about sex?
Oh, man, there goes my dinner…. (averting keyboard vomit shower)
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I’m sorry that misread my reply. Shallow poseurs like Roissy or Roosh were not what I had in mind when I used the term “manosphere.”
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ts very hard to enter a mainstream career track in middle age.
Trust me, “mainstream career tracks” are waaaaaaay overrated.
Hell, “careers” in general are overrated, for that matter. Anyone who is really desperate for one is welcome to have mine.
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Sometimes they even distance themselves from native Africa Americans because they don’t want their kids being influenced by the out of wedlock births and consequent poverty and dysfunction.
Change the “sometimes” in that first sentence to “almost ALWAYS.”
I have yet to meet an African immigrant to America who wants anything to do with the indigenous African-American community. They will give you many reasons for this if asked, the most common ones being the distaste they have for Black America’s dysfunctional culture, along with esoteric racial/ethnic aversions (many Black Africans consider African Americans to be of “impure” blood lines).
The interesting thing is that these attitudes are reflected by Africans in their own continent as well. I’ve visited Africa twice (Nigeria and Kenya), both times as part of a large American groups containing African Americans. In both countries, the locals with whom we interacted very visibly and deliberately shunned the African Americans in the group, much to their chagrin and anguish. It was really a rather sad thing to see.
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TBYF,
Not ghee either, that’s too slippery! Hahaha!
“g up” is how Urban Dictionary puts it.
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TBYF,
Good observations. On the morning trains to London you see so many African children heading to their private schools. The parents make all the necessary sacrifices to make that happen.
Those children aren’t gangster! Their aim is Oxford and Cambridge and then to the City.
I do not live in London but AFAIK it’s the 2nd generation Caribbean children, mimicking AA culture who are into the gang/victim attitude and pretty much going nowhere.
“…the lower income Pakistani and Bangladeshi Muslims…” Politics again! In the 60s there was a plan to build a dam in North Pakistan and an English company was bidding for the contract. The UK government sweetened the deal by promising to relocate the village inhabitants to England. Did they care about the ramifications of that transplant?
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Just as long as you’re being nice because that’s who you are, and not because you’re trying to appease other people.
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“For years feminists have been telling us women can’t consent while drunk.”
And for years they have been wrong.
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Wallace, no mockery from me. I’m white, a bit older, and never been in a relationship — the insides are probably okay, but I’m … well, kind of really fat, so I can understand the lack of interest and opportunities I had.
I think you sound fine, you sound like you were raised like me — seek a RELATIONSHIP, not just someone to mash funbits together with.
FWIW, as long as you can look at yourself in the mirror, both literally and figuratively, you’re doing fine. I envy you. At the end of the day, you HAVE to be yourself. You can lie to everyone else, but not yourself.
Take care, and be well.
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It seems that hook up culture is equivalent to whoring to men. But without paying.
I wonder if USA is becoming a mulato country, like Brazil.
If white women just care about the size… there is no return.
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Try hookers. Hookers love you to be a sexual beast. But they love you to be nice before and after sex. There is no contradiction.
With normal women you have to be a sexual best, too, but you have to be rude the rest of the time. Before and after. If you are not a rude person and you are polite and kind person they will puke at you and laugh at you. Normal women.
Treat whores like ladies, treat ladies like whores, and you will go places.
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But you found Mr. JB. Is always second chances to meet the man of your life,
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I was a teenager in the 80s. I went to the Spandau Ballet concert in Madrid. 1986. Awsome!
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What if the guy is very drunk and the gal is sober.
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First off, that’s a very insightful reply from Goober, thanks a lot man. Secondly “shaming” isn’t really a thing that works on me, I couldn’t care less if anyone thought any less of me for something that isn’t wrong. And yes I am genuinely nice to everyone.
Right now I’m trying to build the life I want for myself. It’s not easy. I was born in one of the worst hellholes of a country on Earth, and climbing my way up has been slow and painful. But I’m getting there!
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The guy is still a rapist. Remember: while women are never responsible for their actions, especially if they’re drunk/stoned, men are doubly responsible for their actions while in such a state.
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Except promiscuous sexuality is not confined to the college campus. In fact, most out of wedlock mothers are not in college when they become preggers, and many never go to college at all.
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Keep being awesome, Wallace.
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Point taken, and well considered. I’d like to think you’re wrong, but I’m not clairvoyant. I have lived with her for 15 years now, though, so if what you say is true i’d sure like to think I’d have seen it.
And I’m not, nor have I ever been, “sensitive” with her. I was still a confident manly-type with her, just not a drunk asshole. Big difference, IMHO, as I’m sure you agree.
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“Good observations. On the morning trains to London you see so many African children heading to their private schools. The parents make all the necessary sacrifices to make that happen.
Those children aren’t gangster! ”
– Most African American kids aren’t “gangsta/er” either.
However “gangsta” and other dysfunctional representations are very much a part of American media pop culture.
I’m not just talking about the Hip Hop genre of music either. Listen to current mainstream American music of almost any genre and it is full of low consciousness, anger, discontent and dysfunction.
I’m an American born and bred and I was never able to relate to “American culture”. Heck, I’ve never even liked our food.
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“Hell, “careers” in general are overrated”
I agree. However some people are into having them. More than that, some people need them to support their families.
I think owning your own family business is a great thing but not everyone can do it. And out of those who can, not all of them make enough money to support their families in a healthy, functional way.
Many individual or family start-up businesses go bust in no time. Plus, you usually need money to make money.
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My friend’s gramma’s “how I met your grandpa” story involved her going on a double drive in movie date, but the other girl bailed, so she was in the back seat with her guy, but then decided she liked the guy in the front better, so she climbed over the seat to be with him.
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Kate Taylor Pimps Penn’s Hookup Culture
Written By Susan Walsh at July 17, 2013
Kate Taylor’s article describing the hookup culture at Penn has attracted a lot of criticism, most notably from Penn students themselves, including some who participated in her research. They disagree with her characterization of women as fueling a no-strings sex norm, and reject the featured “mysterious A.” as typical of Penn women. They appear perplexed by her motives, which are rather transparent upon inspection.
However, Taylor’s article is useful in that it does tap into a very real subculture on campuses that offers little support and sometimes actively discourages the formation of relationships in college. Her error is in failing to realize the full array of female attitudes, which offer a nuanced and diverse view of sex and relationships on campus.
Taylor begins by highlighting the largest obstacle to long-term relationships in college, the peripatetic nature of the contemporary college education:
They envisioned their 20s as a period of unencumbered striving, when they might work at a bank in Hong Kong one year, then go to business school, then move to a corporate job in New York. The idea of lugging a relationship through all those transitions was hard for many to imagine….Moreover, by senior year, the looming prospect of graduation and job applications made many students leery of dating…These women said they saw building their résumés, not finding boyfriends (never mind husbands), as their main job at Penn.
While Taylor exaggerates by focusing on the top 1% here, it’s true that many college students – both women and men – face the threat of a looming expiration date on any serious relationship. Couples are often from different parts of the country, and have limited say in where they may work or live once they graduate. In addition, they prefer to keep their eyes on the prize; they are getting an Ivy League education to maximize their future options and opportunities. Amanda Wolkin, a Penn student who responded to the article in Philadelphia Magazine, remarked:
$50,000+ a year would be a pretty hefty price for a dating service. Sorry, Susan Patton.
It’s no wonder that students feel ambivalent about commitment:
There’s this hypothetical, ‘I would like to be in a relationship, because it’s like comforting and stable and supportive,’ ” a senior, Pallavi, said of her friends’ attitudes. “But then, the conversations that I’ve had, it’s always like, ‘Well, then what do I do when we get to May, because we’re graduating, and so where do we go from there?’ That uncertainty is a huge sort of stop sign.
…Hypothetically, if I were to enter into a serious relationship with someone right now,” she said, “would I honestly say to them: ‘We’re going to spend two years in Philadelphia, and then with some kind of crazy luck I’m going to spend eight years somewhere else? And God knows what you would have been doing for the two years that we were still in Philadelphia — you either would have to up and leave with me, or we’d have to do a long-distance.’ That’s just too much to even ask anyone to commit to.
_______________
Read more here;
//www.hookingupsmart.com/2013/07/17/hookinguprealities/kate-taylor-2/comment-page-5/
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Denying that sex is a bonding activity is denying human nature. Furthermore, it’s dangerous. Sex is very beneficial if performed [frequently and vigorously] within a positive committed relationship. Anything else will bring spiritual and emotional dissonance, at best, and lethal diseases, at worst.
My pragmatic and comprehensive public school sexual education taught me how to get through a decade of dating without any of the latter, but they didn’t talk nearly enough about the former. That, I had to piece together. To do that, I really took my lumps.
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Why not?
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Yep. The “Hook-Up” culture started waaaaaay before the ’90s! lol!!
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I find it interesting the way you seem to equate what happens in your little rural backwater as indicative of what is the prevailing norm, when in reality just based on pure population numbers it is nowhere near it.
The fact is 48% of children in the US are born out of wedlock and for women under 30 it is over 50%.
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“Sex is very beneficial if performed [frequently and vigorously] within a positive committed relationship.”
Don’t you mean “marriage”?
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“The fact is 48% of children in the US are born out of wedlock and for women under 30 it is over 50%.”
Where did you get these stats? I knew it was high, but didn’t think it was quite that high.
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I hope the women hooking up are at least getting some orgasms out of it. Somehow I doubt it though.
So whats the point?
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I dunno. Amongst famous Feminists going back 100 years till now, most are of average looks like most women. Some were particularly attractive, some particularly unattractive, but most just look like the rest of us look – Average.
I think most of today’s women identify as “feminist”. We are all reaping the benefits of first and 2nd wave feminism here in the West. So while we may not be “activists”, we certainly DO believe in equal civil rights and DO benefit from the activist work of women from by-gone eras.
There are A LOT of lazy stay at home moms. I mean look at the Manosphere’s Ladies Auxilery. Many of them are commenting online like every day, almost ALL DAY, though they claim to be “homeschooling” and “home steading”.
Now if they were REALLY home schooling and home steading they wouldn’t have all that idle time on their hands.
I’ve often said that The Feminine Mystique would have never been written had Betty Friedan had the internet to keep her occupied all day like today’s bored housewives do.
Even my own mother, she was a great, loving mother, but once I was set off to school she went back to bed for a nap, woke and did some light housework and laundry, and then spent the rest of the day til I returned watching TV, eating and talking on the phone.
And she gained weight as a result.
This is what many of today’s “red pill wifeys” are doing, except the TV has been replaced by blogs.
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You’re more impressive as a person the longer I read you. I don’t know many smart people that can say “huh! I don’t know”.
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So, your theory is that The Man is so bad he’s keeping down Brother Man in…France?
You even destroyed your own argument: “Hell, you go to Korea and you can hear black rap and references to african american hookup culture”
True. Without the attendant crime and dysfunction. You *almost* had a point, when it was English only being spoken (ie transmission of culture), but seeing as how we’re talking about France and other places too, no, it really isn’t. And you’d have to have an explanation for ALL THE CULTURES IN AFRICA. Sorry for the all-caps, but it seems all important.
So, America has had ghetto influence in all Asian societies, and they ape it, just like Londoners and in the Banlieus. But all Asian societies are doing well, at least sociologically, and none have the gang culture. On top of this, African cultures ALL have the dysfunction. All of them, despite massive differences.
Basically, your theory cannot possibly be true. MTV did not destroy Congo. It did not make the 3rd arrondissement a shithole.
Can you hear yourself? Your blaming rap for killing five dozen cultures in two dozen countries. Are you basically willing to go to ANY length to avoid blaming the people who are doing bad things?
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They didn’t “break up black families”. There is no culture of slavery hurting black culture” because since the end of slavery to the 1960’s blacks had over 95% marriage-baby rate. How did slavery wait 120 years to destroy the black family?
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Again, a JB commenter completely neglects to do comparisons: the Chinese have minorities everywhere, and most of them came over not through the MIT-Ivy league circuit, but due to extreme hardship: low-class Chinese immigrated MANY places they are now succeeding. They are doing well in over a dozen countries.
So, this destroys your demographic specialist theory. Just not right. There are no Chinese gangsta-hoods in South Africa, despite the fact the place was settled by terrified peasants. You’re just wrong.
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You’re basically denying the dysfunctional British-African culture exists by saying you see some kids on the train.
Sorry dude, the levels of British/black dysfuntion is through the damned roof. And they’re ALL recent immigrants.
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“The Holocaust lasted 12 years.
Slavery lasted 250 years.”
Uh, no. Pograms were carried out for centuries in Eastern Europe, long before the Nazis.
And, slavery has existed for thousands of years, and slaves are still kept in the millions in the Third World. Many or most of these slaves are Africans. It’s just that chattel slavery was ended (by whites) in the West, largely in the 1800s.
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Are you talking about human trafficking for the sake of sexual slavery? Where are all these current “slaves” that you are talking about? Who is buying and selling them and how – online? Open outside markets?
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Human Trafficking for Sexual purposes is nothing new. Many of these people, work in brothels, factories, converted homes, back rooms, spas or are just personal sex slaves. I hesitate to use the word ‘slave’, however often passports are taken away, and/or these women have to pay a transport fee (£27,000, for a British Passport). Thus taking away their freedom.
Luke is totally correct. Google ‘Modern Day Slavery or Contemporary Slavery’
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” I hesitate to use the word ‘slave’, however often passports are taken away, and/or these women have to pay a transport fee (£27,000, for a British Passport). Thus taking away their freedom.”
If you hesitate to use the word “slave” for them, then for whom would you use it?
I googled what you said and found this:
The Economics of Modern-day Slavery
Why does slavery still exist?
At its heart, slavery is an inhuman perversion of a simple economic principle: the best way to maximize profits is by minimizing the cost of labor. In today’s global economy, the seemingly inexhaustible demand for cheap goods and services has created a vast, largely invisible market for easily replenished supplies of men, women and children who are forced to work against their will, for little or no pay, and under constant threat of violence or intimidation.
What kind of work do the enslaved perform?
Forced labor is present throughout the world and takes many forms. The enslaved work as field hands harvesting crops, as seamstresses in back-alley sweatshops, as kidnapped fishermen or child soldiers, and as common laborers so deeply in debt that their obligation can never be repaid. Increasingly, the enslaved are women and children – mostly teenage girls, and younger – caught up in the global sex industry of prostitution, pornography and pedophilia.
According to the respected International Labor Organization (ILO), there are at least 12.3 million people in some form of forced labor — in other words, about four of every 1,000 people in the global work force are enslaved. About 12% of these (1.4 million) are involved in commercial sexual exploitation.
Where is slavery today?
The bulk of the ILO’s estimate of 12.3 million in forced labor is in Asia, where some 9.5 million persons are in some form of exploitative agricultural, industrial or sex work. Slavery is also present in Latin and South America, in sub-Saharan Africa, the Middle East and North Africa. Industrial and agricultural slavery is also present in the western industrialized nations, including the United States, but these countries are increasingly beset by commercial sex slavery.
Are people really being bought and sold into slavery?
An illegal and largely invisible market in trafficked humans exists around the world, fueled by graft and corruption, porous national borders, ineffective law enforcement and – increasingly – by the insatiable demand for sex.
Human trafficking — the modern term for the slave trade — is a multi-billion dollar business that is increasingly fueled by sexual exploitation. In 2005, the ILO estimated that total profits from the commercial sex industry approached just under $28 billion, and that overall, trafficking in humans has grown into a $32 billion business, second only to illicit drug sales.
All told, according to the ILO, approximately 2.45 million people are being trafficked in the world at any given moment. Nearly half of those being trafficked are for commercial sex exploitation and, increasingly, the victims are girls age 18 or younger.
Who is behind slavery?
Since profits derived from slave labor can be quite lucrative, there’s no shortage of “entrepreneurs” looking to get into the business. In many instances, the slave trade is viewed as a profitable add-on to existing business in illicit drug trades and body organ trafficking.
Although organized crime gangs are involved in trafficking, much of the trade in humans is carried on by individuals and small groups of criminals Always vigilant to capitalize on opportunities, traffickers were busy in the aftermath of the South Asian tsunami in 2003, sweeping up suddenly orphaned children, and they were hard at work in Haiti, according the UNICEF and other relief agencies, within hours of the devastating earthquake in early 2010..
Unscrupulous labor traffickers round up desperate laborers in Mexico and Central America and help them enter the U.S., where they then entrap them in bonded labor situations. In Latin and South America, indigenous people are especially vulnerable to be entrapped as laborers in dangerous agricultural or industrial work. Increasingly, slave traders are specializing in “niche” businesses: sex tourism in Southeast Asia, prostitution in eastern Europe, American children as “actors” in porn videos.
Trafficking also arises from extreme poverty. It can be seen, heartbreakingly, in families selling their children because they can’t afford another mouth to feed. Family problems create a source of ongoing supply for experienced traffickers, especially during economic downturns. Traffickers, often with police complicity, are known to prey on desperate parents by promising to arrange good paying jobs for their children or an opportunity to learn a trade or craft. In this way, untold thousands of vulnerable children have disappeared via the promise of a better life.
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We’ve had Asian gangs in the US.
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I agree. Why do it (have sex) if you don’t enjoy it?
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This is common sense. No matter what “the media” or any other “they” say, I’ve found this to be true for both women and men.
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I loved the 80s! Fun music, fun fashions!
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can i quote this article. I took parts of this for this blog post. http://seculartraditionalism.wordpress.com/2013/06/13/parallels-between-black-communities-and-societies-under-the-attack-of-feminism/
let me know if it is okay?
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It’s lovely!
An interesting perspective from Jamaica.
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Thank you, and thank you for this post. As someone black I totally agree it is not racist to point out that the social structure in post-slavery communities was and very much still is similar to hook up culture. It is not a white people thing. It is not new. And it is not as good for society, children and people in general as what the traditional relationship has to offer.
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If they’d stop acting like that, then there wouldn’t be an issue.
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JB, you should correct this article. The rate of black women having children OOW has been steadily declining for years. It’s almost enough to make me want to shout in ALL CAPS, but I will spare you. I will simply repeat: *the number of black women having children out of wedlock has been steadily declining for years.* This is statistical fact. But guess what, like everyone else, married black women are having far fewer children than their married mothers did, and those who are having kids out of wedlock are having more than the married women. That’s how you end up with 70% of *births* being OOW–note, that’s not how many *women* are giving birth, but how many *births* have taken place.
You take the compassionate conservative tack, but misusing and misinterpreting statistics only makes things worse.
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