Yesterday’s entry was cross-posted at A Voice for Men, and there are two comments over there that capture a few truths we don’t like to talk about very much in the wider culture. The first one lays out just why Mr. Nice Guy wants nothing to do with ladies like Isabel, no matter how interested they are now.
Dear Isabel
I spent twenty years trying to be nice to women like you, and in return I received nothing but contempt. What makes you think I would be inclined to welcome you into my life now?
While you were sleeping, I changed too – I haven’t remained “nice”, every ready to “be there” for you, just waiting to drop everything to be by your side and take care of you. Your contempt and your sadism changed me. I am now what you would think of as “nasty”. Not one of the bad boys who used to excite you, but one of the increasing number of men who has come to see you as their enemy.
An equal relationship with a woman like you is simply not possible. What you have to “offer” me is this:
1. The chance to have children entirely on your terms, when you see fit
2. The prospect of losing those children on your vindictive whim
3. A total loss of control over my own money
4. Arbitrary confrontations and accusations
5. A partner who believes I exist to serve her, and who refuses even to acknowledge the concept that I have feelings of my own beyond those she has decided for me.
6. The loss of whichever of my hobbies and friends you dislike
7. A partner who can physically and mentally abuse and manipulate me, then dismiss any protest I make about it
You expect me to be instantly “ready” for you now, simply because you are ready for me? For me that shows that you expect our relationship to take place very much on your terms and not at all on mine.
Whilst you were changing so was I. I have become very happy without a woman in my life. And I have realised that you have nothing to offer me but pain. It is too late for you.
Sincerely
Mr Nice Guy
The second comment is actually making me jealous. It boils down Isabel’s solipsism and narcissism beautifully, by reducing her article to pronouns. Here it is:
Dear Nice Guy,
I don’t know… I’m so ready… Seriously, I am… I dated… I was… I guess I dated… I liked… I fed off… provided me. I saw… I … accepted. Let me… I’ve dated… I ended up… I always had… I clearly knew… I don’t regret…
I learned… I learned… my house party… I guess I never let… I realized… never me… I was born… I was never… a jerk to me… I was smart enough… I never actually wanted… I wanted…
… I’m ready… I’ve learned… the lessons I need… I now have… I know… I’ll let you… I know… I know… I can see… my life… time for me… I want…
… It’s time for me… when I feel… time for me… the fear that I’ll be emotionally shamed… time for me… I want… my body… look at me… my mind, body and soul.
I want… make time for me… always respect me. I want… I will be safe… I know I can learn…
I don’t want… I hate… I don’t hate… I’m just done… I have to thank… taught me… depend on myself… my broken pieces… allowed me…
I understand myself… I know what I’m like… I’m ready… what I’m like…
[some platitudes]
So, I guess all there is left to say is…
I…
These two comments pretty much sum up the problems, don’t they? I suppose the real question is where do we go from here? On that subject, I really have no answers. MGTOW seems to say: total rejection, while traditionalists say: back to a past of male control that never really was in the first place. Neither of those approaches are fully satisfactory, but I’m not sure what the plausible alternatives are. I think Dean Esmay does a really nice job explaining the limitations of both approaches in this article, but the way forward is no more clear even with such an understanding.
How do you make someone as profoundly clueless and selfish as Isabel understand? She seems to have all the moral awareness of a two year old, but at least with two year olds, you know that time will pass, and they will grow up and see that the world consists of more than just their own viewpoint.
Isabel? I’m not so sure.
I’ve decided to change the tagline on this blog from Because you don’t know shit, which was admittedly just a throw away line I put little thought into, to this: JudgyBitch: The radical notion that women are adults. Seems a fitting change on the day the blog hit two million views.
Let’s hope women like Isabel can embrace such a radical notion.
I won’t hold my breath.
You probably shouldn’t either.
Lots of love,
JB
judgybitch 
> On that subject, I really have no answers.
Why does marriage work everywhere but in Western Europe, North America and Japan?
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“…where do we go from here?”
Honestly, I think the only option is not to try and talk to women, but to reach out to guys and stop this stupid in-house fighting.
The WRM has several decades of advancement on the MRM. Right now, we’re at the same place the WRM was back in the 60’s. Things can advance faster because we have awesome communications ability now, but it will still take several years to get the MRM into the mainstream conscience.
Until then, we need to educate men, get them to stop degrading each other, and work together as a relatively cohesive unit. Men are really good at working together, building or destroying with equal grandiosity. We need to harness that fire and drive it right through the heart of the WRM.
Plan of Action:
1) Outreach to men via the internet.
2) Attack the WRM websites and articles by signing up as members so we can post JB-like sarcastic quips for other readers to see. Use sarcasm and humor to illustrate their imbecility. Make them a joke.
3) Use social media like Twitter and Facebook to counter WRM articles as they appear. Look for ways to contradict their posts with easily-found facts. Reference the Judgy Bitch site as often as possible on social media sites. Don’t mention anything about AVfM or the like. Keep it strictly between JB and GirlWritesWhat for credibility’s sake.
Basically, apply Alinsky’s rules to the movement and wake guys up. I think once enough guys see that they’re not alone, things will change quickly. I know too many guys that share the same sentiments but wouldn’t have mentioned it if I hadn’t brought it up first.
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I personally believe it is because progressive ideals and radical feminism took deep root in Western Europe and the US. I think marriage works in Japan, but more people on both sides seem for whatever reason to be avoiding it. I do wonder if Japan’s busted economy for well over a decade, added to the generational shift between pre- and post-WWII philosophies and governments might have had any further impact.
In other areas, people are still struggling, either against poverty, oppressive governments, or both, so they don’t have inordinate amounts of time to navel-gaze and decide to up-end centuries of customs and values.
All IMHO.
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I don’t think Isabel is real. Or should I say her sentiment isn’t genuine. I think it was set up so perfectly. Smells trollish to me. Now folks are whacking it like a pinata (to lazy to find that little tilde thing). The whole thing just seems off to me…
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> progressive ideals and radical feminism
Marxism is an effect, as is feminism, MRA, etc. What was the cause of the collapse of marriage in the Marx-infested West?
Another way of getting at the same thing:
Be they ever so varied, what characteristic is found all happy marriages?
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As much as I do not like quoting the bible…
“Two cannot walk together unless they be agreed.”
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It really does to me too. Hard to imagine that any woman, who are generally fairly quick to smell a change in the winds of social circles, would put out such a solipsistic piece in the midst of a general internet backlash against female narcissism. The troll nature of “Isabel’s” piece seems stronger to me when I consider the response piece on naturalthinker.
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If you look at Isabel’s other pieces, it seems consistent. I’ve linked to one in which she describes what a mess her family situation is, although of course Isabel sees it as perfectly ordinary.
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Funny that the most Marx-infested area in Europe was Russia, Ukraine and Belarus. Just the countries were marriage still working quite well. And feminism is not accepeted. Mainly by women.
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On the one hand, I want to believe you that it was in fact a serious piece. In that case, you’re making me more and more thankful that I never married with each response to me calling it a troll.
On the other hand… holy shit…
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PS, thanks for changing your blog sub-title, it’ll probably help your blog slip past the porn filters.
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Do your hair and makeup. Put on an outfit that makes you feel hot and confident. Look at yourself in the mirror and really meaningfully say, “I’d hit that.”
Stare at yourself in the mirror naked. Get to know your body. Stroke your legs from top to bottom to understand their length. Run your hands over the curves of your bum to understand its size. Grab your fat and realize you really should work out.
Speak in a British accent for a day. Realize that it makes you feel ten times more intelligent. Think of ways you can stay talking in this accent forever. Wonder if it will actually have any real impact on your real IQ.
Her advice for how to amuse yourself when you’re unemployed. What didn’t make the list?
Polish your resume
Volunteer so you won’t have a gap on your CV
Leverage your network to find new employment
She really is….. clueless
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“How do you make someone as profoundly clueless and selfish as Isabel understand?”
The answer to that question is both simple and final: You Cannot.
Isabel and all Western Women like her are so filled with arrogant pride and hubris that (like the unrepentant Nazis after the end of World War II) they would rather have civilization and society come crashing down upon their heads, than to ever consent to humble themselves and admit that they were wrong.
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Here’s the link
http://thoughtcatalog.com/isabel-chalmers/2014/04/15-most-productive-things-you-can-do-when-youre-unemployed/
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JudgyBitch, I think you are being a little unfair to Isabel.
After all, she is offering her youth to Mr. Nice guy. Not her 50s.
If I would be Mr. Nige Guy I would accept the deal. But always under HIS conditions.
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> “Two cannot walk together unless they be agreed.”
Nice. Who initiated this transaction? Who drove it while it was still working? What happens when that party stops driving?
A transaction (a meaningful exchange of values among volunteers) only happen when the buyer buys.
What is the state of an ongoing transaction when the seller stops selling?
Marriage is the man’s relationship from the outset, and it fails, when it does, when he stops wanting it enough to drive it.
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Just another navel-gazer. Yawn. I like this man’s response to it though. Unfortunately I think our culture as a whole is fairly narcissistic and that women in particular are encouraged to think this way.
However, some of the responses over at AVfM reminded me why I stopped visiting men’s rights forums. It’s like they’re parodying feminism. I see little difference between self-righteous “nice guys” moaning that there are no good women, vs. self-righteous “ladies” moaning that there are no good men.
In either case I think they either choose jerks or their personalities are revolting to the opposite sex. (Like the “nice guy” and Princess Me.) A few get it though- if you are having problems with the opposite sex, maybe it’s because you choose them.
By the Way JB, I love your new line, “The radical notion that women are adults.”
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“Marriage is the man’s relationship from the outset, and it fails, when it does, when he stops wanting it enough to drive it.”
No, marriage is more like dancing. A dance can have problems when a man fails to lead, a woman fails to submit, or both, just like in marriage.
In recent decades, women have been failing to submit in marriage in the West. Not so much outside the West.
Assuredly, Feminism has attacked the notion that men should lead and that women should follow/submit, especially in the West. Feminism, however, also asserts that problems in marriage are always due to a man’s failure to lead–never to a woman’s failure to submit.
It is clear that you are a feminist.
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Excellent point!
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JB:
I don’t know if you saw this yet, but Chalmers’ post brought a stinging rebuttal and response:
http://thoughtcatalog.com/leo-steven/2014/04/dear-girls-who-are-finally-ready-to-date-nice-guys-we-dont-want-you-anymore/
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> It is clear that you are a feminist.
When your math betrays that you didn’t do the homework, everyone knows, not just you and the teacher.
Again:
>> Who initiated this transaction? Who drove it while it was still working? What happens when that party stops driving?
http://selfadoration.com/the-runaway-minivan-families-fail-when-fathers-wont-lead/5412
He was in charge of the relationship from the beginning. He initiated it. He nurtured it. He pursued it. He escalated it. And he put the ring on it.
Is that untrue?
If not, then how did he lose his leadership role in the marriage? She took it from him? Why would she? She was buying everything he brought to market back when he was still selling hard. He surrendered it? Now we’re getting somewhere.
Why does a marriage that worked once not work any longer? Because the man is no longer driving it.
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Agree. Is kind of the same.
Men going always behind the heartless bitches, femme fatales, bad girls, lolitas, sluts… not paying attention to the sweet prude girls in the High School (you can see it in “Grease”). getting their hearts broken by the vamps and then crying and complaining: “where are the good women?”
Just one difference. When this broken men finally marry a plain good woman they take economic responsibility.
When the broken women finaly marry a nice guy, HE takes economic responsibility too.
Always the man.
So, the answer is ALWAYS marry a rich woman.
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I was making the more basic point that harmony cannot exist where disagreement over roles does.
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She is begging, she is on her knee, like Isabelle Adjani to the British Lieutenant in “Story of Adele H”.
But the British Lieutenant is a young handsome arrogant womanizer with an exciting life in the Royal Navy.
This time the girl, the young girl is begging for the plain boring Mr. Nice Guy.
It is all a triumph!!!!
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You have a faulty view of marriage–that it can be accurately viewed by a “driving” paradigm. It is more like couples dancing than like driving. “Driving” is a faulty paradigm for marriage. Marriage is highly interactive, unlike driving, but like couples dancing. I suspect that you accept the “driving” paradigm because it supports your TradCon illusion that men are in control in marriage and allows you to avoid fighting feminists, who are the real enemy. Hence, you buy into the Feminist Imperative that when there’s a problem, always blame a man. That’s why I say that you are a feminist.
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My apologies if I misunderstood you.
> disagreement over roles
Where would this begin? Too disputatious to date? Can’t happen. If he had to fight his way in, that’s rape. She was a happy volunteer to his leadership all along, no? If not, the relationship could not have advanced from one step to the next. When did that change? Why would she suddenly compete for dominance when she had not done so before?
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On marraige…like any relationship, it is a partnership. It requires cooperation and compromise on both sides. Without this it fails…or at least struggles.
I think all of us are naturally dominant or submissive so if we meet the wrong type of person and form a relationship it’s going to be a struggle unless we change.
Marraige shouldn’t be about who’s in control, who’s responsible for what, who has such and such rights…once it deteoriates to that level it has no future imo.
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Women like her, they are for us as the “Bad boys” are to them, selfish egotistical bitches who even if you do get to date one will only cause you pain until they eventually move on to someone else.
she will be very lucky indeed to find a “nice guy” now, as we grew up and matured we learned that we deserved better than her, and we are grateful we were overlooked back when we hadn’t yet learned that lesson and would have jumped at the chance to treat her like a princess.
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As a matter of ontology, as the practical expression of our biologically-engendred sex differences, in a male-female relationship, the male will be dominant. Not dictatorial, just the moral leader of that little polis, that family.
This will be the case even after he has ‘checked out’ – seemingly abdicated on his leadership role – because while he can lead her, she cannot lead him: He will not yield to her dominance.
There is more, the teleology inexorably implied by that ontology: The man is leader of the marriage because he waives the right to swoon – in battle and in the bedroom – conceding it to her.
All of this is actually expressed biologically, whether they like it or not – or even know that it is going on – but understanding it conceptually makes it possible to negotiate it rationally.
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“Where do we go from here” suggests that the slide can or should be stopped. The internet’s false promise of allowing women to hook up with six and seven figure earning men has ruined women forever. I just say go with it. Let’s see what a 100% fatherless society looks like. Hint: Build more prisons.
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1) Re plunging marriage rates in Japan: both men and women increasingly see marriage as a price they either can’t (men) or won’t (women) pay. Men there commonly literally can’t afford the economic cost it carries there, while women there commonly chafe at the restrictions on their freedom to live the Sex and the City urban life. (These also are increasingly the case in urban coastal China.) This goes beyond the usual feminism making marriage less attractive in reality to many men, and pre-wall women.
2) Not being mentioned is how the epidemic of post-marital near celibacy wives institute is becoming known. If a girlfriend did to me what most American wives now do WRT permanently cutting the sex back to 1/10th (at best) the frequency and variety of what it was in the first 3 months of being together, I’d consider it a de facto breakup, and act accordingly. But, of course, between the divorce court’s chilamony/wholesale asset robbery certainty, and the modest, ~95% probability of her getting the children, marriage in the U.S. is a kind of trap.
Given #2, men should only marry in America if they are CERTAIN they want to have children with that particular woman, AND are willing to largely or completely give up having sex in their lives after the last kid is conceived. (Forget even men’s porn as a partial outlet if married to many women, who will self-righteously rail against it as “adultery”, while Lifetime is programmed into their TV remote, and copies of Harlequin novels and Vogue magazines litter the den.)
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A man who claims that a woman should submit to him just because he is a man, demonstrates that he is too weak to lead by his own competence.
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With an attitude like yours, no wonder that men don’t want to dance with you. Men are leaders in dancing and women are followers. That is the rule of the couples dance floor. A man cannot force a woman to follow by his sheer competence. You are very much mistaken.
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> A man who claims that a woman should submit to him just because he is a man
This happens when? This is not how romantic relationships begin. To the contrary, she accedes willingly to his leadership until he betrays her trust, in her estimation. Do you dispute this normal progression of events?
This post
“What makes a good marriage so good? Simple: A man in charge.”
http://selfadoration.com/what-makes-a-good-marriage-so-good-simple-a-man-in-charge/5579
presents a fuller rendering of the arguments I’ve made here.
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I put about equal blame on a) technology; b) feminism; c) overpopulation. I personally believe that marriage is over *except* for young, traditional couples such as Mr. and Ms. Judgy Bitch. The rest of us are probably better of in party-line relationships without the “benefit” of bringing in the state, and ideally without producing more than a percentage of “replacement value” in children–if any.
Meanwhile, the modern woman needs to come to terms with the reality that her “love” is worth very little in the modern marketplace and therefore ought to come up with some value-added features geared toward the man she wants to attract, such as *character* (honesty, loyalty, patience, humility, dedication, etc.) along with skills that are worth something to the relationship, and perhaps a dowry.
Of course, women being adults would also be a welcome change. For starters, I’d like to see women copping to their true age–in Earth years. That would be a sign of maturity.
A fitting substitute for marriage might be something on order of a blood oath but without benefit of subpoenable witnesses wherein both parties have something to lose along with, of course, offering love and trust. An “insurance policy” of some sort is warranted.
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the future is going to be an especially dark place for women. feminism has the blood of millions on it’s hands. millions of innocent men and boys who were destroyed, who were made to hate themselves, who killed themselves, who broke their backs and their souls sacrificing for nothing.
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bof.. you bark at anything too quick. that isabel charmers is a 21 year old. takes the meat away from all snyde remarks..
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You assume that because I made a comment that annoyed you, it means that no man would be interested in dancing with me. That’s a bit presumptuous of you.
My point is that dominance and submission are relative to each other. Is it possible to “fail to submit” in the absence of leadership?
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I’m splitting hairs, really. I don’t dispute what you are saying. In fact, given that women tend to be attracted to men who are somehow superior to themselves, I would say it is more important to women than men.
However I am very grateful that we as a society have moved away from the notion that a man has automatic authority by virtue of his sex.
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Feminism did all that by itself? Is feminism responsible for all the wars and economic and political oppression through all of history?
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By the way, are you familiar with Athol Kay and his website married man sex life? He has a plan to save marriages and it works.
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“JudgyBitch: The radical notion that women are adults.”
My choice would be:
“JudgyBitch: The radical notion that women should be adults but won’t.”
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I think he’s referring to abortion.
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JB: “MGTOW seems to say: total rejection”
Remember, ‘going their own way’ means MGTOWs are individualistic and vary, unlike traditionalist, which is a category with a common social value set.
As such, not all nor (perhaps) even most MGTOWS subscribe to the “total rejection” of romantic and/or sexual relationships with women. Just as often, an MGTOW is using an MGTOW state as a way to step back, reassess, change his life with positive masculinity, and re-calibrate his outlook on women and family, and society generally.
For example, M3 at http://whoism3.wordpress.com/, who has a girlfriend, speaks to my kind of MGTOW.
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This isn’t going to be a popular post, but, for every Mr. Nice Guy who was rejected by an Isabel there is a slightly overweight, coke-bottle glasses wearing Matilda with a brain, a good heart, a shoulder to lean on, and a career who has been rejected by a Mr. Nice Guy while he pursued an Isabel. By the way, Matilda is now a hardcore feminist who works on some US Senator’s staff and writes the domestic violence legislation he proposes…
Sooo… where do we go from here? That is the question. MGTOW, WGTOW, marriage 3.0., traditionalism. Sadly, I think the future looks bleak. Here’s why. Relationships between men and women are based upon NEED. Men and women seek specific things from each other, whether they mean to or whether its instinctive. Women seek men for support and protection. Men seek women for sex, family, and companionship. If we could flip a switch and tomorrow MRAs had the world they desire: where women work just as much and earn just as much as men; shared custody is the norm; marriage has been revamped without alimony, child support, or wealth exchange from man to woman; the artificial womb has been created, there is male birth control, parental surrender, and sex bots… What would all this mean for relationships between men and women? Well, there would be no relationships between men and women. If a man could have sex with a bot and implant a baby in an artificial womb, what would he need a woman for? If a woman has to get up, get out there and earn her own way, buy herself a BMW with her own money, what would she need a man for? Many MRAs seem to believe men don’t need women, but, women need men. What for? Women hate watching the game, just as much as men hate watching Say Yes to the Dress or some girly show. Why would men and women bother putting up with each other, if they don’t NEED each other, as would be the case in a fictional MRA world?
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Caprizchka,
Hmmmmm …… 2 of your comments resonate with me ….. would you plzzzzz share more about ‘party-line relationships without the state’ and ‘fitting substitutes for marriage eg. blood oaths’?
Are you referring to ‘hand fasting’ ceremonies for example?
Regards,
I AM …. phillip
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LOL …. I get it + onto it, Spaniard
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JB: “I suppose the real question is where do we go from here? On that subject, I really have no answers. MGTOW seems to say: total rejection, while traditionalists say: back to a past of male control that never really was in the first place. Neither of those approaches are fully satisfactory, but I’m not sure what the plausible alternatives are.”
How about complementarian as a 3rd way alternative? I’ve classified your blog as complementarian.
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‘where do we go from here?’……..
“Evolve or die’ Eckhart Tolle in ‘A New Earth’
from my positionality and awaeness of Eckhart Tolle’s writings and teachings, he is referring to ‘Evolve’ consciousness level (CL), vibration, frequency, presence, energy, spirituality, personal growth …..
therefore my Tip42Day is to accept the reality that:
“I AM 100% responsible and accountable for evolving my consciousness level and it is my life purpose and goal and no. 1 priority”
+ unless I am asked, other people’s CL. beliefs, feelings and points of view are none of my business ………
LovenLightnBlessings to you all, from
I AM ……….. phillip
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I think the first is empowering while the second is insulting. You get more flies with honey and all that…
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What makes you think it works in eastern europe?
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Not certain ‘teleology’ or ‘ontology’ are used correctly here.
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In Russia:
*Women live for their family. The meaning of life of any woman is her children and hubby.
*Women marry young.
*Women do not iniciate divorce.
*Women get nothing with divorce. No money no goods.
I am not saying this is good or bad. I am not a conservative. But Russia is a conservative European heaven: family, Church, army, motherland, black/brown people not welcome (does not matter if you have the American passport). gay propaganda banned, feminist propaganda banned…
And it was the most Marx-infested area in Europe.
By the way: this conservative values are strongly supported bt the second party in the parliament: the Russian Comunist Party of Genadi Zyuganov. Not only by Putin.
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JB – I love your writing. But I am a bit confused about your new tagline. You just pointed out how Isabel seems to have all the moral awareness of a two year old – and she represents millions of women. Yet your new tagline is: JudgyBitch: The radical notion that women are adults. hmmm. The radical notion is that women should start ACTING like adults.
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“She was a happy volunteer to his leadership all along, no?”
No, that is incorrect. She was happy about some things and unhaaaaappy about others. She was rebellious always, just like Eve. That is woman. The notion that there are two kinds of people in church–women and sinners–is heretical.
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“Speak in a British accent for a day. Realize that it makes you feel ten times more intelligent.”
Blimey, don’t I feel smart, guv’nor?
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Good point. Frivorce, followed by no access to kids for the ex-husband, then the ex-husband’s suicide is all too common. Cash & prizes for the ex-wife, too. Ex-husbands who landed in prison because they got laid off and were unemployed and couldn’t make the child or alimony payments. This is the legacy of feminism and its no-fault divorce with cash & prizes for the ex-wife.
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“ideally without producing more than a percentage of “replacement value” in children”
You realize that the white race is dying off all over the world, right? Whites aren’t having enough kids to replace themselves.
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You might use “The radical notion that women shouldn’t act like entitled princesses” if you’re looking for controversy.
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I don’t think so.
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Hello,
I just read your brutal cup of truth article and I have an interesting point related to it. near the end of your article, you said that so called traditionalists want to return to a past of male control that never really existed. in the article by dean esmay that you linked in he talks of traditionalist women that want to return to a tradition of female power and sexuality that was never real. so my question is, if neither had the power, who did? oligarchies? this seems most likely. (duh, to myself not you). also do you agree with mr. esmay’s statement that women never really had power in addition to your statement that men never really had power? what comes to my mind is a sort of cold war stand off with each sex mistrusting and scared of the other. or in a repeat of a previously proposed notion, was it that people in the oligarchy were the only ones that had power and nobody else did? that seems likely.
another interesting point you have made is that you believe, and the evidence seems to support this, that the man being the sole wage earner makes him vulnerable to being robbed by his wife and disposed of. I have previously thought that the wife working as well as the husband makes the husband’s existence moot, as well as making it easier for her to walk away from a marriage on account of her being able to make a good living for herself and not needing him to support her. that is not to say that women should be destitute if they don’t have a man in their life. I am noting that since I am a young man looking at my prospects that it seems that if I am not careful I could be damned either way.
one point that you don’t seem to cover in your blog is that if white men, ( yes I am assuming that you are primarily addressing the men of your ethnic group. It’s all probabilities you see. ) can’t find any good, loving, loyal, steadfast, responsible white women to marry, then they should seriously consider marrying outside of their racial group. ( or you know keep an open mind from the beginning ) interracial marriage isn’t taboo anymore. ( I know what a shock. ) if the woman that completes you like a missing piece of your soul that you never knew you had isn’t the same color as you so be it. we are all human. the only thing keeping us from being human is ourselves.
– Myself
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“Unfortunately I think our culture as a whole is fairly narcissistic and that women in particular are encouraged to think this way. ”
I see that in how women are portrayed, but since men are disrespected in the media, generally, I don’t see how narcissism applies to men.
“I stopped visiting men’s rights forums.”
Do you visit Just4Guys or dalrock?
“I see little difference between self-righteous “nice guys” moaning that there are no good women, vs. self-righteous “ladies” moaning that there are no good men.”
Are you sure that all the men complaining that young womanhood is broken are Nice Guys ™? From what I’ve seen lots of PUAs say the same thing and are doing pickup because they see no future in marriage. Why would any man want to marry a slut who is likely to divorce him? Or ask him to pay to raise someone else’s kids? Or cheat on him during marriage? From the statistics I’ve seen, 96% of young women are sluts. That doesn’t leave a lot to choose from.
Women who complain about there being no good men typically have the expectations of entitled princesses and don’t see the Nice Guys ™ as good men–the Nice Guys ™ are invisible to them. Those women typically rode the alpha carousel during their 20’s, then were shocked to discover that no betas wanted them for marriage when they were ready.
There is a _vast_ difference between the two.
“A few get it though- iA few get it though- if you are having problems with the opposite sex, maybe it’s because you choose them.”
I choose to not marry a slut. If I were single, that would exclude 96% of women. Is it worth it to look at the 4% who are left, if I can even find out who they are? We know that women go to great lengths to hide their notch count and it’s hard to find chaste women with all the virgin shaming.
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Well, what we need is more sensible couples raising children in a healthy family environment, and fewer single mothers spawning sprogs for the sake of government benefits. The easy solution would be to cut the state sponsoring of single parents, and preferably introduce male reproductive choice in the form of paper abortions. Then we’d see a reduction in the number of single mothers, and slowly but surely, people like you, JB, would have a chance at out-reproducing the selfish morons of the world.
The trouble is the present environment selects both socially and biologically for selfish, stupid perma-infants, rather than intelligent, practical women. Once the environment changes, I have hope that the subspecies of narcissist feminists will become extinct pretty fast.
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I agree with the second. Most women don’t want to be treated as adults because that implies responsibility for your actions. That’s not nearly as fun as being a princess.
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I think you’re missing out on a key point, TD. The problem with the WRM isn’t that they want women to go out and be completely autonomous, but that they degrade and vilify men. They ignore the fact that men do not need women nearly to the degree that women need men (which irks them no end).
You say that men want women for sex, family and companionship, which is true. But women have made those things so incredibly difficult to procure and endure that they are no longer of any real value. The ride isn’t worth the cost of the ticket.
As JB has noted in other pieces, men are the ones that make this world turn, not women. Women help to produce the next generation of workers (men), but that’s really where their contribution stops. But the WRM takes it to an extreme, denying those inconvenient truths. What would she need a man for? How about roads, sewers, bridges, electricity, factories, telephones, cars, planes, trains, minerals, houses, office buildings…. all these things built and maintained by men.
Yes, on the micro-scale women want a man for protection and support in a relationship. But they demand that it be 100% on their terms, at their whim, and the law now backs them up. That’s not a relationship.
Men, on the other hand, aren’t asking for the moon on a necklace, but simply to be acknowledged as good and decent people that do the lion’s share of the work. No man would mind having a loving relationship with a woman if they were on equal footing, but they’re not.
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Women’s potential serious contributions are domestic stuff: bearing children, raising children, cleaning, cooking, clothing the family, managing servants. There are potential social, health, and microeconomic benefits to the family which are very serious.
Women’s potential fluff contributions: shuffling papers, getting coffee, blogging (;)), etc.
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Qué buena estás.
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“What would she need a man for? How about roads, sewers, bridges, electricity, factories, telephones, cars, planes, trains, minerals, houses, office buildings…. all these things built and maintained by men.”
Women don’t need men for these things. These things have already been designed, created discovered, refined… You get what I’m saying. Women don’t need men to build roads. We have already figured out how to build roads. If a bomb hit tomorrow and destroyed New York state. It would be rebuilt. Just b/c you don’t see lots of women on the side of the road at a construction site, does not mean women are incapable of pouring concrete or something. Women choose not to do these things. Furthermore, with respect to needs the way you describe them here, most men would need these things too. Do you know how to make a phone??? Most men would be in the same position as women would be in if NY was destroyed tomorrow. What I am talking about is the type of need that brings people together. Women seek out a partner for support and protection. If that need is gone what would bring the sexes together??
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lol
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Sorry to burst your bubble, Eastern Europe is just as rotten. Something cataclysmic has to happen for things to start getting better. Also, marriage does not work very well in muslim countries, I happen to know a lot of turkish and syrian families, same thing – cheating, shouting, ‘the dog house’…
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If not he’s still correct.
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There’s that politically correct buzzword again. Please.
When you women start acting like adults then it should be changed. Until then, nada.
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Surely.
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Like that will fly. heh
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The flies–WGAS? We can GOOW.
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Every time I see one of you young entitled princesses, I get a visual of some guy’s cock in your mouth and his splooge all over your face. You are very unappealing. Flies. 5h1t. How apt.
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Bingo. That’s why I wrote it. Trust me, almost none of them are actually interested in real equality. I don’t think equality is something that will EVER be achieved.It’s no int their DNA.
Either men or women will dominate (although the women only seem to be able to do that when the men ALLOW it). Paul Elam is a good man but he’s only fooling himself if he thinks equality will ever be achieved. I mean think about it for a minute. Women are attracted to a man who is stronger, taller, and wealthier than they are. Hell in the bedroom the inequality is even more extreme (and seems to be increasing with time). In the realm of sex almost every girl I’ve gone out with confessed that they wanted me to do something like hold them down and “do as I pleased” with them”. Most even wanted to be forcibly tied up and ravished (I’ll stop there to avoid an X rating. This isn’t really the place for it anyway). Does this sound like someone who is interested in equality? It’s in their DNA to be below a man.
Yet, because women have been thoroughly brainwashed by feminism they’re now VERY confused. Their brainwashed head is telling them one thing while their DNA is telling them the opposite. This is why they can claim the silly “strong and independent” label while simultaneously finding a man that is stronger, taller, and wealthier than them.
Not only that but even if a women is single she’s STILL completely dependent upon men. Her electricity, running water, air conditioning, insulation, cable, computers, internet, car and even her house (the list is almost endless) were all invented, built, and maintained by men. Women and their newborn children survive childbirth at a HUGELY higher rate than in centuries past due mostly to the innovative spirit of men. Hell, even tampons were invented by men! Even Camille Paglia admitted that if it weren’t for men women would still be living in grass huts.
Is it any wonder that women in general are now more unhappy than ever? And frankly, if men had put their foot down and refused feminism from the beginning it would never have gotten off the ground. Nut no, they decided to be little pussies and white knights and look where it got us. Our families are destroyed, leaving us naked before the state. Government grows without limit and has been made into a god over families. You destroy the father in a household and you destroy the family.
People can call what I wrote “misogyny” all they want. But the real culprit in inequality isn’t men, the patriarchy, or aliens from outer space. It is NATURE. Argue with it instead of me. All the wishing, grinding of teeth, legislation or feminist indoctrination in the world will NOT wipe that out of existence. Equality is a myth. That my friend, is the REAL red pill.
Stop chasing a unicorn.
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““What would she need a man for? How about roads, sewers, bridges, electricity, factories, telephones, cars, planes, trains, minerals, houses, office buildings…. all these things built and maintained by men.”
Women don’t need men for these things”
Oh, no. They don’t men at all. LOL!! Can this person be any more delusional?
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Women are wired so that they need men to desire them. That is the essence of their sexuality. Without men, they would go mad.
Men need to have sex with women. That is the essence of their sexuality. Without women, it’s porn.
When a burglar breaks in at 2 a.m., the husband turns to the wife and say, “I heard a noise.” Then the wife gets her gun and goes to check it out. Oh wait….
And I could go on about military defense and the sexes.
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Men’s rights and Feminism couldn’t be more different. Men’s rights isn’t just simply crying about ‘no good women,’ no we are far, far, far past that quaint notion. If the greatest threat we had was simply a broken heart, that would be Heaven. You’re at least 20 years behind the times.
No we’re coming from a place of zero legal rights in any situation with women at all. Divorce laws are of course completely unacceptable for men, but even just dating is too dangerous. Just one night of alcohol and you regret it the next morning, off to prison I go for the next 20 years.
Would YOU even DATE someone under those insane circumstances and laws? OF COURSE NOT. Even simply turning down women in the U.S. today can and does lead to a false accusation of rape and sexual assault, that is how vindictive and toxic you have become.
You can tell me you’re ‘not like that’ – doesn’t matter, I don’t know that, it’s the fact that you CAN under the insane laws in the U.S. I’m not going to get anywhere even close to someone who has God-like power over me legally.
Imagine if rape were legal in the U.S. – women would be running around screaming to every man they encountered, “this is crazy, we have to do something!” And then each man would very smugly and dismissively say, “Hey, not all men are like that.”
THAT is what it feels like when you say ‘not all women are like that.’ Because U.S. divorce laws are a rape of our entire lives and everything we have worked for and so are your never ending false accusations and psychotic rape laws that will end our lives with a point of a finger with no evidence (Brian Banks).
Feminism is nothing more than women screaming for even more privileges for women and for even MORE insane laws to be passed that make men’s lives unbearable. For now at least we can avoid most of the danger by simply avoiding you altogether. For now. There is no telling what nightmarish laws may be passed this decade to make men’s lives a nightmare.
If there was a law passed before the end of this decade making it illegal for any man to enter a public place where there are women and children present for fear that all men are violent rapists and pedophiles, I wouldn’t be the least surprised. That is how insane all of this has become. And that is where we are at. You as a woman in the U.S. and me as a man in the U.S. we have absolutely NOTHING in common and my world is nothing like yours at all.
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“If you want a happy marriage, marry the man who burns to be happily married forever to you. Marry the woman you can’t bear to live without. No other marriage can work for long.”
I don’t know if anyone noted the implication of those words: The love that is dispositive in a marriage is his. She has to love him, obviously, but the marriage will be happy to the extent that he loves her more than he hates the thought of losing her. This is why arranged marriages worked, because he went into it with the expectation that it _would_ work so he worked hard to _make_ it work.
More fun: As always, we are steadfastly striving to solve a terrible problem by looking at it from precisely the wrong direction:
Women can’t fix marriage. Only men can.
http://selfadoration.com/what-makes-a-good-marriage-so-good-simple-a-man-in-charge/5579
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As a matter of counter-vailing brutality, this is what a bad marriage to an unreformed slut looks like after dad has checked-out on the relationship:
http://selfadoration.com/telling-long-stories-about-other-peoples-nightmares-for-fathers-day/4869
There is a bit contract language in that story that could prove to be a great conversation (conflagration?) starter in your marriage.
This problem is eminently solvable, JB, but it will only be solved by men.
Women can’t fix marriage. Only men can.
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You’re one of those churchian heretics who say that women have no agency and aren’t commanded to submit to their husbands. People like you twist and mutilate scripture for your own ends.
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TD, don’t ignore the facts. http://judgybitch.com/?s=%22end+of+men%22&submit=Search
Women cannot do what their brains aren’t wired to do. It’s not as if there’s anything holding them back from entering the rough and ugly world, maintaining the foundational constructs of our society. They don’t enter those professions because they know that they cannot do those professions. The few women that do work in them are statistical outliers and usually have more masculine traits than feminine.
But even still, men aren’t complaining that there are no women in their fields. Men don’t mind doing the work, hard as it might be. What men want is for women, and society as a whole, to show some respect for what they do. Instead, they demean them and make jokes about them.
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“These things have already been designed, created discovered, refined”
Hahaha You are WAY out of touch with reality with no corresponding intelligence to the world in which you live. All of these ‘things’ as you put it, is your entire WORLD.
That men are ALWAYS inventing new ‘things’ for and designing newer, better working versions. Like your CAR, little girl, does is look like a Model T, the first mass produced cars?
Not to mention men MAINTAIN it all and REPAIR it all. There are at least a million new inventions every year, Dunce.
Plus 99% of all the NECESSARY jobs are all done by MEN. Including growing your FOOD and processing and delivering it, maintaining your plumbing and your electricity. I suppose you are so out of touch with reality and how your world operates you’ve lost sight of what is in front of you every day.
Here are the top 20 jobs more women are in than any others:
http://www.dol.gov/wb/factsheets/20lead2010.htm
Want to know what jobs MEN do? Take that list and subtract it from the TOTAL list of ALL jobs and you have the answer.
If women disappeared tomorrow, the world would get by just fine. If MEN disappeared tomorrow, half of you would be DEAD within 6 months, so hopelessly unable to fend for yourselves. Your ignorance just reinforced that fact.
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Total rejection of marriage and committed relationships by men is the one and only thing that is going to bring about the changes we seek, because the one and only thing that will stir women into changing the status quo is when they know they are facing a lifetime of involuntary singlehood. Women aren’t going to change out of the goodness of their hearts, or out of foresight for future generations. They have to be affected directly, and then they have to be aware of the cause.
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At least Russia remains white, Christian, homophobic male chauvinist and hawkist.
Said this: I am not racist, neither homophobic, machista or church goer.
But… I love the idea of a big territory keeping PURE the eternal European values.Must be some place like this. The whole world being as gay friendly as Spain or cosmopolitan as London or feminist as Sweden or secular as France or antimilitaristic as Costa Rica is a nightmare.
Viva la diferencia.
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Latest studies suggest that wars are inciated by female influence. “Lebensraum”. They need resources.
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Yup. And mangina churchmen do it endlessly. They’re pathetic.
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How do you make someone as profoundly clueless and selfish as Isabel understand?
You probably don’t, because she probably can’t. She’s obviously completely oblivious. I don’t necessarily buy into the line that she’s evil as a result – I think a person could make the argument that she thinks she’s being sweet and quirky by writing this, and meant it almost as a “mea culpa” rather than the selfish, solipsistic spew that it actually is. She’s just dense. Socially, romantically, and most importantly, in regards to her own self-awareness.
She has no understanding of the concept that sometimes, when everybody is treating you like you’re a piece of shit, that the problem does not lie with “everybody.” Maybe you really ARE a piece of shit?
So if every man that she’s ever been with has treated her poorly in her eyes, maybe that’s not because every man she’s ever been with has been a bad man, but rather, she’s a shitty woman?
This is problem #1 with feminism, or really, with any supremacist movement. They are so involved with pointing out everyone else’s flaws that it is inconceivable to them that they may have flaws of their own. It makes for mal-adjusted, poor excuses for human beings, like Isabel. It causes white supremacists to rant about criminality in the “brown” communities, while committing crimes of their own. It causes feminists to rant about being subjugated, treated like second class citizens, and getting a raw deal, while they work as hard as they can to subjugate others, and treat them like second class citizens, and give them a raw deal.
My advice to Isabel would be to take some time outside of a relationship to learn who you are, before you get into another relationship by which you’ll define yourself as something you are not, yet again. Turn the tables. Put yourself in someone else’s shoes for once. Learn some empathy. Understand that possibly, just MAYBE, that when you and your significant other get into a fight, that sometimes the solution won’t be “allowing him to make it up to you” so much as YOU making it up to HIM. Until you can, Isable, I would suggest that you stay the hell away from relationships like they are a disease, because to someone like you, that’s exactly what they will be until you pull your head out of your ass.
She seems to have all the moral awareness of a two year old, but at least with two year olds, you know that time will pass, and they will grow up and see that the world consists of more than just their own viewpoint.
A pretty standard malady suffered by the youth of our nation, I’m afraid. Isabel is 21 years old. She was raised in a society where there were no winners or losers. Where everybody gets a trophy. Where everybody is a special snowflake just the way that they are, and the idea that you need to change in order to conform to societal standards is just beyond the pale. Isabel has been told her entire life that she is literally infalliable, because anything she does is the right thing, because it’s what she wanted to do. What did you expect?
JudgyBitch: The radical notion that women are adults.
Not a foregone conclusion, it seems, given the arguments against female agency that feminism is constantly throwing out there. “Triggering?” Really? Isn’t the notion of “triggering” an awful lot like that of the olden-times’ “hysteria?” The notion that a woman will react viscerally, emotionally, and uncontrollably to things that make her uncomfortable?
So feminism has fought for a century now to shitcan offensive notions like “hysteria” just so that they can bring them back under a new name, as an excuse for doing whatever the fuck they want, and never having to hear anyone disagree with them?
How about THAT for your next blog topic?
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I don’t think I could come up with a multi-cultural ceremony that would be applicable to all readers, and even if I could, I wouldn’t.
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What are we going to do about it?
‘We’ are already doing something about it. Or at least the men are – especially the young men. They are simply doing what men have always done; survey their environment, understand it, and behave rationally according to it.
And for increasing numbers that means that if they can’t find the kind of woman they want they are choosing to go elsewhere, or without.
Feminism broke the social contract between the sexes – the woman’s fertility traded for the man’s utility. The cost of this contract for each sex was different; women had to behave according to men’s standards and men had to provide and protect women.
So you can’t liberate one sex without automatically liberating the other. Women have clearly embraced their new freedoms, and for a while life has been sweet, for whilst they played by the new rules, men were still playing by the old. But now men are playing by the new rules as well. And what does that look like?
Men no longer have any obligation to take care of women. So they don’t
Simple statements. With HUGE implications. For if you are no longer obliged to take care of women, then why strive for that high paying job, why study for credentials, why take on any of those burdens traditionally born by men for the benefit of women. When you can simply do what you want?
This is what true equality looks like. And today’s young men are embracing it. Good and hard.
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I’m not going to dignify anything that implies that quantity is more honorable than quality and that doesn’t say a whole lot for your “race” if that’s what you believe.
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Jim
You are not really thinking about the question. Where do we go from here? If a twenty-three year-old female software engineer graduate came to you for advise and asked what do I need a man for…. What would you say to her? She is completely able to support herself financially. As far as safety, she can buy a pit bull or a gun. Put aside your offense b/c I’m not trying to offend you. Honesty, what would she need a man for? I am not talking about want. I’m talking about need…
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Having a husband so that he can go hit a burglar with a bat is something every women WANTS. It’s not a NEED. There are plenty of single women all over the world and they are fine. Further, a gun will completely resolve that burglar issue. I’m talking about NEED. What does an educated financially capable women NEED with a man?
While some MRAs imagine this world where men and women are both out in the work place earning equal pay for equal work, such a situation would likely mean an end to humanity. Some MRAs complain that men are slave and women don’t contribute enough financially. But, the very fact that many women don’t put as much effort into their careers as men do leaves women in a state where women need men for support and this need leads women to seek relationships with men and sustains humanity.
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They learned the hard way, as it appears the west is going to have to as well.
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That sounds real good to me.
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Sorry but you are the one not thinking about the question. Try harder. Oh, and good luck.
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I meant advice, not advise
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A doctor invented a steam-powered vibrator to treat hysteria. Maybe triggering could be treated similarly.
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On cultural narcissism, I am American. Our nation was founded by malevolent narcissists who fought for their own freedom while keeping others in chains. America was built on slavery and genocide. White Americans systematically destroyed others’ cultures, and now some smugly claim that those people’s problems are cultural problems. They desecrated holy lands for gold and to build monuments for themselves. What they call “history” in school is conspicuously untruthful. Is it any wonder there are problems with our marriages now??
I don’t see much difference between male and female sexual behavior. Men and women both cheat. The PUA is a slut too, and possibly a tit-for-tatty one at that. It’s no more attractive on a man than a woman imo. But sluts tend to outgrow that idiocy as they mature, just as people outgrow the idea that it’s fun to drink until you puke.
If you want to limit yourself to having a relationship only with a virgin, I think you’re limiting your options unnecessarily but if that’s your kink then go for it.
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Toilets and roads are nice, but I would chew off my arm before consenting to live without the love and companionship of my man. I need that.
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A dominant man induces a woman to want to submit to him naturally. He doesn’t need to go to the big boss for help.
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Well said. The days of a woman being able to stroll into a room and announce “These are my needs,” expecting every man in range to rush to meet them… they’re dead and gone.
It was called ‘chivalry.’ And in an age of equality, it has no more relevance than whale oil and spinning wheels.
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No, your error is that assuming that leadership automatically results in submission. You still want to blame the man for a woman’s moral failures.
No question that there can be a lack of leadership. However, even with great leadership, lots of women refuse to submit. Consider that God is the perfect leader, yet hordes of women won’t submit to Him.
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If you’re a Christian sweetheart then it applies whether you like it or not. If you’re nor a Christian ten it doesn’t apply.
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You’re not a man, so who cares what you think.
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True point. Do you also believe that slaves should submit to their masters?
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Nice troll face. That section also commands men to love their wives as Jesus loved the church. That means you should be willing to die a torturous death for the love of your wife. Are you capable of it, or are you too self-absorbed?
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Cadders,
Absolutely ….. that describes my positionality brilliantly ……. as a humanitarian, I CARE ABOUT much, including many expressions of the Divine Feminine and Masculine and MotherEarth ……. and as part of my own liberation I realised about 20 years ago that I have no obligation or responsibility to TAKE CARE OF my wife, mother … and women …… and it was a ‘game changer’ and ‘barbeque stopper’ ….. my mother’s ‘payback’ came when her ‘Will’ was read …. I got some ‘crumbs’ and my younger brother’s co-dependent ‘caring’ manifested the ‘lions share’ for him …….
… and it took 6 months to successfully negotiate with my wife that 5% of my income and time was for my use only, no questions asked ……. that set the ‘feral cat amongst the pigeons’ …….. yet was incredibly liberating …… especially when I chose to ‘accumulate’ my money + time then went interstate and participated in my first ‘rite of passage’ program, ‘Sacred Call of the Wildman’ ……. resulting in sustainable ‘liberation’ within the marriage ….
For me, equality includes equality of integrity + truthfulness in inputs, processes (incl. spaces, choices, decision making) and outcomes ….. otherwise ‘GIGO’ …………
‘You cannot make a silk purse from a sow’s ear’ Unknown
I AM …. phillip
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TMG,
My sense is that for me to remain single actually best serves my pure intention, journey and evolution of consciousness ….
“I’m more interested in consciousness than relationship” Gary Douglas, Founder, Access Consciousness
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“Myself”, I disagree vehemently with your proposal for Western white men to marry women outside their race with the idea of having children with them.
Some links why this is a rotten idea:
http://tinyurl.com/kavkq2l
http://tinyurl.com/l98xvgd
http://tinyurl.com/ag4s9zu
http://tinyurl.com/ma83txq [run this one on out, and not too long past 2100, there will be NO whites left alive in the U.S., a real “Camp of the Saints” deal] (refers to classic book by Jean Raspail)
http://tinyurl.com/dkw5zm
http://tinyurl.com/deqzc5
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Rebecca, women are commanded by God in the Bible NOT to teach (especially theology) to men. Theasdgamer is being not rude, but Christian, in telling you to be silent and listen to the men.
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Your racist beliefs are the result of a 500 year campaign designed to justify treating humans savagely. Whites systematically destroyed others’ cultures, beat and murdered their patriarchs, stole their labor and their lands, impoverished their language, and gave them Christianity to subdue them.
Your facts have been refuted around the internet if you care to look. JB has written on why it is logically incorrect to use so-called IQ tests to draw conclusions about race. Your crime stats are faulty too. To illustrate: you can point to the fact that men are arrested for domestic violence much more than women. That is proof that men are violent and women are innocent, right?? No of course not. It’s proof of bias in the system. Same with crime stats on race.
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Silly me, I thought he was trolling. When he said he imagined me with a cock in my mouth and splooge on my face, was that Biblical too?
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Solipsistic, much?
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Last night I danced several dances with the wife of a colonel in the British Army and taught her about dancing. She made me feel smarter praising my dancing in her English accent. XD She was fun.
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You obviously missed my point about how I see young women. If I even consider possibly kissing one, the image I discussed before is so abhorrent that I can’t consider kissing a young woman. Some other men are having the same reaction. My comment is unavoidably insulting and it’s a very sad comment on most young women.
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Do you even know what solipsism is? Do you know what projection is? If you are disgusted by your own pornographic fantasies, that says more about your state of mind than anyone else’s.
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Women don’t need men for these things. These things have already been designed, created discovered, refined
And who do you think maintains all those things so that you can continue to benefit from them, Miss Einstein? //cornea-rending eyeroll//
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They’re also ubiquitous. This is why any established, incorporated organization calling itself a church is an organization to be avoided at all costs.
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Nice troll face.
Pot, meet kettle.
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Oh, I know what female solipsism is–but apparently you don’t. Female solipsism is the tendency of women to take anything said and apply it to their own selves.
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Solipsism is the philosophical position that one cannot know for sure of the existence of anything outside one’s own mind. If you see people laughing and think it’s about you, that’s having ideas of reference. I guess mra’s change the meaning of words for their own use. Mkay.
Nevertheless you responded to my post back there and specifically referred to something I wrote. Now it’s, “Oh I didn’t mean *you*, you’re solipsistic.” Uh-huh.
By the way, if you’re angered and disgusted by pornographic images, stop Googling them. Such images typically don’t just come up on YouTube.
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As your reply amply stated, assuming that nothing exists outside of you.
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“I’m interested in both.” –Jack Strawb
There are not at all mutually exclusive.
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